Diane Whitehead wrote about wanting a chart that would better summarize seed germination requirements of various Allium species. I too would like to see such a resource, but must admit to being personally negligent over the years keeping any germination records. So I will generalize. I find that those species that have thin flake-like seed, or angular crescent-shaped seeds, generally germinate readily when exposed to cool, moist conditions outdoors, after 2-6 weeks. Those species that have hard, round, pellet-shaped seeds, generally require a longer cold period of stratification, and may require a year before germination. The Melanocrommyum alliums (giganteum, karataviense, etc) fall within this catagory, as do a large percentage of the western American species. A few comments on Diane's Allium germination records: 1. >A.flavum ssp tauricum - 10 days. A couple which >germinated in March 1998 flowered in summer 2002. I'm going to guess that you held the seedlings in pots. I have a similar experience with plants in seedling flats or pots, taking 3 or 4 years to bloom. I have found that if the seedlings are planted out in the garden the first year they germinate, they will flower the following spring. Regularly I have beds of 1-year old flowering seedlings. The inflorescence size is typically under-sized the 1st year, but in the second year you'll get full sized blooming inflorescences. It might take 4-5 years to determine the growth characteristic of each seedling, whether a good prolific clumper or not. 2. Please note, the following are almost never available true from seed: anisopodium, forrestii, and suaveolens. The first species is grown frequently (it's no great beauty) so it's surprisingly why this species is always misnamed in the seed exchanges. I do not believe that A. forrestii is in cultivation. After a dozen or more years trying to get the true A. suaveolens, I was sent seed of the true plant from wild-collected source years ago and still grow it to this day. It is very likely that plants you've grown from seed are not true... typically A. senescens usurps the name. 3. >A. siskiyouense - 10 days That sort of short germination time for this species surprises me. I've only had it germinate after a much longer time, and have yet to bring a bulb to flowering stage. 4. A. splendens v. kurilense - 3 weeks There is no such thing as splendens v. kurilense. I was very interested in this name because it shows up all over the place, so I wrote to a couple botanists involved with the genus Allium, botanists who have worked extensively in the russian, mongolian, siberian, and asian flora, and they claim that there is no such species. One such botanist that has studied the "splendens/lineare/strictum" group more than any other; Dr. Friesen, confirms that there isn't anything by this name. So it's any one's guess what the seedlings will turn out to be. Mark McDonough Pepperell, Massachusetts, United States firstname.lastname@example.org "New England" USDA Zone 5 ============================================== >> web site under construction - http://www.plantbuzz.com/ << alliums, bulbs, penstemons, hardy hibiscus, western american alpines, iris, plants of all types!