From dells@voicenet.com Sat Sep 1 12:46:02 2007 Message-Id: <20070901164557.8859D4C017@lists.ibiblio.org> From: "Dell Sherk" Subject: FW: Pacific BX 152 - CORRECTION Date: Sat, 1 Sep 2007 12:45:41 -0400 -----Original Message----- From: Roy Herold [mailto:rherold@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, August 31, 2007 5:51 PM To: Dell Sherk Subject: Re: [pbs] Pacific BX 152 Dell, You listed two types of cyrtanthus seeds. I only sent the hybrid. Sorry if my description was confusing-- I realized it was after re-reading. --Roy ----- Original Message ---- From: Dell Sherk SEEDS: 5. Cyrtanthus brachyscyphus x Cyrtanthus elatus? hybrid This is the very first time I've ever had seed set on any of my cyrtanthus. I had tried selfing in the past, but to no avail. This past winter I had brachyscyphus and a hybrid in bloom at the same time, and put them nose-to-nose several times. Voila! 6. Brachyscyphus is by far the most reliably blooming cyrtanthus for me. The hybrid in question is a bit shyer with its flowers, which are much larger and a soft orange color. It looks identical to one that Lee Poulsen posted on the wiki: Foliage is glaucous, both are evergreen. From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Sat Sep 1 17:55:34 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Theories - Late Summer bulbs(Lycoris), rain etc.? Date: Sat, 1 Sep 2007 16:54:38 -0500 Dear Friends, So much for theories, plans and vagaries of nature. I wrote earlier about my theory I'd see abundant secondary /late bloom on Lycoris following a good rain. We did get a 1/2 inch here and there, but not enough (still) to really soak in. Lycoris squamigera had a second flush. The first bloom was meager and about 1/2 the usual height. The second flush was -..well..... Where I had 7 stalks earlier at 1/2 height, here came 27 new stalks at less than 1/4 height; barely an inch or two above ground and elongating to 4 inches. Very odd looking. No improvement on Lycors chinensis, longituba or other hybrids except - L. caldwelli. One spot that should have 20 plus stalks has 4 stalks, yet in 4 other spots it is blooming as usual with 1/2 dozen stalks each and nearly normal height. I fail to see a pattern, other than that these will bloom if they MUST regardless of rain and heat as long as the time comes around. I seriously doubt I'll see anything much later than this unless we do get some good soaking rain, cooler temps and perhaps some L. radiata will show up in a month or so. Right now the garden is essentially at a stand still. Too hot, too dry for too long and our patience is wearing thin. best Jim W. -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From jshields@indy.net Sat Sep 1 18:30:32 2007 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20070901182352.0274d9b8@pop.indy.net> From: "J.E. Shields" Subject: Theories - Late Summer bulbs(Lycoris), rain etc.? Date: Sat, 01 Sep 2007 18:30:23 -0400 Jim W. and all, Here, we received over 4 inches of rain in a week's time in about the third week of August. Our Lycoris made a weak attempt at flowering during the last week of July and the first week in August. Starting within a few days of the heavy rain, the Lycoris began sending up new scapes from places where there had previously been no flowering in July and August this summer. This late burst is definitely heavier -- more scapes, more flowers -- than the first flush was. So I think I see confirmation of Jim Waddick's rain hypothesis, at least in my garden and with the heavy rain we received in a short period of time. Now some of the Colchicum are starting to bloom, at least in a few spots. The Hymenocallis occidentalis did not bloom at all until after that rainfall. A few scapes are up and in flower on them now. So what are we to conclude? That resuscitation after a drought is dependent on the amount of rainfall received? Possibly so. Jim Shields in central Indiana (USA) ************************************************* Jim Shields USDA Zone 5 Shields Gardens, Ltd. P.O. Box 92 WWW: http://www.shieldsgardens.com/ Westfield, Indiana 46074, USA Tel. ++1-317-867-3344 or toll-free 1-866-449-3344 in USA From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Sun Sep 2 12:21:18 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Lycoris caldwellii - some thoughts and praise Date: Sun, 2 Sep 2007 11:05:57 -0500 Dear Friends, Before the sun heats up the garden, I did my morning patrol and was impressed at Lycoris caldwellii. I mentioned this species briefly in a recent note to PBS. This species is a member of the subgenus Lycoris mostly characterizes by the spidery flowers and fall foliage (though not all fit this generalization). L. cadwellii is an exception in both ways. The flowers are more 'nearly' regular than spidery and foliage appears in spring. The karyotype is identical to that of L. squamigera (2n = 27) and has been sterile here. Like L. squamigera it could be a natural hybrid involving L. sprengeri and L. straminea, but this is just guessing. The flowers in bud show pink stripes similar to L. incarnata, but the buds open a uniform pale yellow tipped with faint pink. During my walk I realized it is planted in six parts of the garden. The most exposed, driest and largest planting is not blooming well. Four short stalks where there should be dozens. Elsewhere the stalks are nearly full size and each site has multiple stems nearly normal. This is very different from all other Lycoris this season . Where they managed to bloom at all, single stems were more common than multiple stems and they were distinctly shorter than normal. Perhaps L. caldwellii shows some better drought tolerance by blooming at nearly normal season, two weeks to 10 days after L. squamigera. So although the pale flowers are subdued, they still are produced in clumps and in the cooler morning air are certainly worth the stroll. On all counts it has performed as well as L. squamigera. Anyone else care to share a good word on this lesser grown Lycoris species.? Best Jim W. -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Sun Sep 2 12:57:45 2007 Message-Id: <001701c7ed82$87c1b9a0$2f01a8c0@Library> From: "Jim McKenney" Subject: Lycoris caldwellii - some thoughts and praise Date: Sun, 2 Sep 2007 12:58:46 -0400 Jim Waddick told us about the performance of his Lycoris caldwellii this year.. While we are on this topic, how about some thoughts and praise for Caldwell? Can anyone tell us a bit about Sam Caldwell himself? I know of him through the article he wrote decades ago for the American Horticultural Magazine on hybridizing Lycoris. What, for instance, happened to his hybrids? Do any of them survive, and if so have they played a part in present-day hybridizing? Jim McKenney jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Montgomery County, Maryland, USA, USDA zone 7 where I've spent the morning sorting and counting Fritillaria bulbs. My Virtual Maryland Garden http://www.jimmckenney.com BLOG! http://mcwort.blogspot.com/ Webmaster Potomac Valley Chapter, NARGS Editor PVC Bulletin http://www.pvcnargs.org Webmaster Potomac Lily Society http://www.potomaclilysociety.org From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Sun Sep 2 15:56:26 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Sam Caldwell ? Date: Sun, 2 Sep 2007 13:43:10 -0500 >While we are on this topic, how about some thoughts and praise for Caldwell? >Can anyone tell us a bit about Sam Caldwell himself? >What, for instance, happened to his hybrids? Do any of them survive, and if >so have they played a part in present-day hybridizing? > Dear Jim, I refrain from my thoughts about Sam Caldwell. He died a few years ago after a long bought with illness. Maybe someone can contact Sue Madison from the IBS list to give her thoughts. Good luck. Jim W. -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From adam14113@ameritech.net Mon Sep 3 13:41:15 2007 Message-Id: <001e01c7ee50$cc0f7d30$642e7790$@net> From: "Adam Fikso" Subject: Lycoris aurea var. surgens Date: Mon, 3 Sep 2007 12:35:13 -0500 Hi. I read the note on L. caldwellii with interest but cannot offer relevant comment, as I do not have it. I note that L. aurea v. surgens, however is setting seed. Of the 6 pod structures on the stem-one is about 3-4 x the largest other swollen ones so am assuming that there is viable seed there. Any suggestions on how to foster greater success between now and possible germination? This must have been self-fertilized or be apomictic, as I had no other Lycoris in bloom at the time which I also find interesting. From johnssmolowe@pacbell.net Tue Sep 4 02:27:13 2007 Message-Id: <1944AE09-D901-43D5-ADFC-42301834C065@pacbell.net> From: john s smolowe Subject: amarygia Date: Mon, 3 Sep 2007 23:27:10 -0700 anyone know of a source of amarygia? please email me off list johnssmolowe@pacbell.net From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Tue Sep 4 10:22:22 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Lycoris aurea var. surgens ?? Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 09:21:28 -0500 Dear Adam et al, This is an interesting species. According to the best I can find, this species is endemic to Upper Burma and like all ssp of L. aurea sub- tropical in growth demands. In my experience and understanding all L. aurea are extremely frost tender and if the winter green foliage (which is the most succulent in the genus) is exposed to even light freezes it will collapse and bloom is compromised. I think that anyone growing a plant with this label and in your Zonel has a misidentified plant. Your " L. a surgens" could be any of various yellow flowered species - the most likely is of course L. chinensis, or L. longituba var flava or a hybrid of these two. The true L. aurea has the remains of its leaf bases still prominent at the base of the scape. Leaves produced in autumn. Leaves are the largest of any species over 2 feet long, 1 inch wide and distinctly succulent. Does this fit your plant? Few people are able to bloom the true species north of Zone 8 or 9. Best Jim W. > > I note that L. aurea v. surgens, however is setting seed. -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From kelly@irvincentral.com Tue Sep 4 11:37:28 2007 Message-Id: <46DD7BA8.6060406@irvincentral.com> From: Kelly Irvin Subject: Lycoris aurea var. surgens ?? Date: Tue, 04 Sep 2007 10:37:12 -0500 Dear Jim: I think I will have to contest you here in the general nature of your conclusion. I am not defending that Adam has the true Lycoris aurea var. surgens. I agree with you in general as to the tender nature of Lycoris aurea, and compared to all other species of this genus. I have only grown the version you sent me, I believe properly identified as L. aurea var. aurea, and I have even more experience with L. aurea var. surgens. Of these two, L. aurea var. surgens is larger in all parts and hardier than the other. I could be splitting hairs here, because the conditions my plants are in creates an artificial environment. My surgens have stayed in foliage down to 13°F, BUT they were in a winter house where the heater had gone out. When I intervened at that temperature, frost had only just started developing where leaf blades were bending over. These frost locations showed damage after temperatures came back to normal, but the foliage stayed erect and in growth. I do not believe nature in temperate North America really encourages this scenario. Chances are frost will develop at much higher temperatures than 13°F, and, chances are, damage will occur wherever the frost collects, which is usually on the whole leaf. The experience of the above described event, though, should at least lead to a theory that under covered protection with a light bulb, even going below 32°F, could protect this plant. This is an extra effort, but I know some folks do this for plants they consider special but for which they fear freeze damage. I do suggest, however, that Adam may not have the described surgens because he is collecting seed. I've never harvested a viable seed off of hundreds of flower stalks. The literature says it is possible, but out of the ordinary. The foliage will be pointed on the end and will start pushing up in October here in zone 6. It will be about an inch wide and two feet long at maturity. var. aurea seeds easily. Several years ago I visited with Sue Madison who showed me Lycoris aurea from two different sources; I don't remember the variations if they were even known, but these were located in an unheated cabin that had a glass covered room and a large flower box or trough for these to grow in. Temperatures can reach zero in that neck of the woods. How low in the glass covered room? I don't know. Frost collection? I don't know. I agree that moisture crystallization on the leaves of Lycoris aurea KILLS. Whether it can kill at 32°F, 22°F, 12°F, or whatever, I don't have enough information. I am not convinced that dry freezing temperatures cause the same damage. Man, oh, man, Jim. I sure wish you were still peddling Lycoris. I still need so many species. Supposedly, L. traubii is common, but I've never found it. I've found L. incarnata from two different sources, FINALLY, but they are sending up foliage in the fall, and I thought they were spring foliage species. This makes me suspicious, but Ping-Sheng and Kurita could have been wrong. Has anybody got speculations on the Lycoris shaanxiensis that is being marketed these days? Chen Yi is probably the original source for all of them. I've been evaluating for several years, unwilling to classify it as such. I am under the impression it is supposed to be spring foliage, but mine are definitely fall. It reminds me of the descriptions of L. xalbiflora, when in bloom, but the foliage is dark green without a stripe and narrow like L. radiata. It's earlier than most Lycoris foliage and seems more tender than L. radiata. Flower color is very creamy, almost buttery and appears to be infertile. Mr. Kelly M. Irvin 10850 Hodge Ln Gravette, AR 72736 USA 479-787-9958 USDA Cold Hardiness Zone 6a/b mailto:kelly@irvincentral.com http://www.irvincentral.com/ James Waddick wrote: > Dear Adam et al, > This is an interesting species. According to the best I can > find, this species is endemic to Upper Burma and like all ssp of L. > aurea sub- tropical in growth demands. In my experience and > understanding all L. aurea are extremely frost tender and if the > winter green foliage (which is the most succulent in the genus) is > exposed to even light freezes it will collapse and bloom is > compromised. From adam14113@ameritech.net Tue Sep 4 12:34:19 2007 Message-Id: <001701c7ef10$a9ca2160$5ad8fea9@FAMILY> From: "Adam Fikso" Subject: pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 4 Questionable Lycoris v. aurea with seedhead Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 11:28:42 -0500 ----- > > > List-Post:<mailto:pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> > List-Archive:<http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/pbslist> > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Lycoris aurea var. surgens (Adam Fikso) > > Kelly Irvin wrote:-- > I think I will have to contest you here in the general nature of your > conclusion. I am not defending that Adam has the true Lycoris aurea var. > surgens. I agree with you in general as to the tender nature of Lycoris > aurea, and compared to all other species of this genus. I have only > grown the version you sent me, I believe properly identified as L. aurea When I intervened at that temperature, frost had only just started > developing where leaf blades were bending over. These frost locations > showed damage after temperatures came back to normal, but the foliage > stayed erect and in growth. > > I do not believe nature in temperate North America really encourages > this scenario. Chances are frost will develop at much higher > temperatures than 13?F, and, chances are, damage will occur wherever the > frost collects, which is usually on the whole leaf. The experience of > the above described event, though, should at least lead to a theory that > under covered protection with a light bulb, even going below 32?F, could > es; I don't remember the variations if they were > even known, but these were located in an unheated cabin that had a glass > covered room and a large flower box or trough for these to grow in. > Temperatures can reach zero in that neck of the woods. How low in the > glass covered room? I don't know. Frost collection? I don't know. > > Has anybody got speculations on the Lycoris shaanxiensis that is being > marketed these days? Chen Yi is probably the original source for all of > them. I've been evaluating for several years, unwilling to classify it > as such. I > > > James Waddick wrote: >> Dear Adam et al, >> This is an interesting species. According to the best I can >> find, this species is endemic to Upper Burma and like all ssp of L. > > ------Well, Thanks to both of you. I am, right now, convinced that this > is probably not the L. aurea from the China-Burma border mentioned by Jim > W. (Chen Yi did collect from there at least once, but I've not been able > to winter over anything from that area) I don't know what it is. At this point there is nothing visible, no leaf remnants at the base of the stem, and I don't remember any 2 foot long leaves. Since the bulb came from you, Kelly, what's your best guess as to ID at this point? I did say that there was nothing else blooming when it flowered, so I thought it was self-fertile, butas I think back--there could have been a squamigera or two still around when this bloomed In which case I have a triploid x triploid seed pod. Not impossible, but highly unlikely. I'd still like to know what your advice is regarding trhying to germinate this. Let it dry first, or plant it green.? I do plan to wait until it's fully mature and dehiscing before I consider planting it. It is wait and see at this point, and keep notes where I can find them in a year. From adam14113@ameritech.net Tue Sep 4 12:41:55 2007 Message-Id: <002701c7ef11$bc44daa0$34ce8fe0$@net> From: "Adam Fikso" Subject: A further note on the contested L. aurea with seed. Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 11:36:21 -0500 I just remembered a detail that may be important. As the flower aged, it acquired an orange tint, approaching the faded dusty orange of L. sanguinea, (as I have it labeled), which bloomed and finished about a month before. From kelly@irvincentral.com Tue Sep 4 13:19:38 2007 Message-Id: <46DD9392.6020500@irvincentral.com> From: Kelly Irvin Subject: A further note on the contested L. aurea with seed. Date: Tue, 04 Sep 2007 12:19:14 -0500 Adam: Way back in '01 you ordered from me L. chinensis. In '04 you ordered L. aurea v. surgens. Maybe you are seeing L. chinensis in bloom, as Jim suggested? Mine only started blooming the last week of August with one or two new stalks still coming up now. In the past, I've taken pictures of L. chinensis in bloom as early as August 21st and as late as September 16th here in zone 6. Lycoris seed is pretty easy, I think. I'm sure there are better ways to do it, but I've been quite successful simply using regular potting medium, saturating it, then pressing fresh seeds into the surface, making sure to leave the top of the seed visible. Ideally, place it in the shade and create a little greenhouse with a clear plastic bag. I like to strip the flag off of two marker flags, bend, and stick into the pot to support the clear bag. A one gallon bag works well on a one gallon pot. This will keep you from having to water very much. When you do water avoid dislodging the seed. The seed will send down a root radical now but will wait until spring to send up the foliage. Actually, it's even easier to take a plastic bag and pull it down completely over the pot and securing with a rubber band, sort of making for yourself what looks like a bongo drum. Once inspections show that roots have emerged, you can remove the plastic, if used, and water occasionally through the winter months. I speculate, in a pot, it would be best to protect from severe cold. Adam Fikso wrote: > I just remembered a detail that may be important. As the flower aged, it > acquired an orange tint, approaching the faded dusty orange of L. > sanguinea, (as I have it labeled), which bloomed and finished about a month > before. Mr. Kelly M. Irvin 10850 Hodge Ln Gravette, AR 72736 USA 479-787-9958 USDA Cold Hardiness Zone 6a/b mailto:kelly@irvincentral.com http://www.irvincentral.com/ From jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Tue Sep 4 14:41:32 2007 Message-Id: <001d01c7ef23$5c279420$2f01a8c0@Library> From: "Jim McKenney" Subject: crickets #)($%&$$#&*(%! Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 14:42:33 -0400 This morning I was thinking that any day now colchicum should start to bloom. So I went around the garden checking likely spots - and I had a nasty surprise. Colchicum have been blooming - and crickets have been eating them as fast as they appear. The only thing left are stubs: eventually these are lifted into view by the growth of the perianth tube. It's been so dry this year we will probably have a bumper crop of crickets. I still haven't forgotten the undulating black carpet of crickets which covered the late summer ground in Texas when I was there years ago. We have grasshoppers this year, too. I'm not happy. Jim McKenney jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Montgomery County, Maryland, USA, USDA zone 7, where bottle gentians have started to bloom. My Virtual Maryland Garden http://www.jimmckenney.com BLOG! http://mcwort.blogspot.com/ Webmaster Potomac Valley Chapter, NARGS Editor PVC Bulletin http://www.pvcnargs.org Webmaster Potomac Lily Society http://www.potomaclilysociety.org From marie-paule.opdenakker@pandora.be Tue Sep 4 14:59:09 2007 Message-Id: <000c01c7ef25$9b18f140$10c6144e@mpaule> From: "Marie-Paule" Subject: amarygia Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 20:58:39 +0200 Hello john Here is a link ,but it is in England. http://www.cgf.net/mail.php?letter=A (cotswold garden flowers England) Regards, Marie-Paule, Belgium ----- Original Message ----- From: "john s smolowe" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 8:27 AM Subject: [pbs] amarygia > From tony@plantdelights.com Tue Sep 4 15:35:26 2007 Message-Id: <46DDB37E.6000000@plantdelights.com> From: Tony Avent Subject: Lycoris aurea var. surgens ?? Date: Tue, 04 Sep 2007 15:35:26 -0400 Jim: We have also heard about the tenderness of Lycoris aurea for years and had shied away from trying it. Several years ago, I saw a collection of Lycoris aurea at Duke Gardens that Paul Jones had made in China. It had grown for several years and flowered well there. We later obtained plants that originated in Guizhou, China under the name L. aurea. When they flowered, they perfectly keyed to L. aurea, which is the only species whose flower stalk emerges with old leaf sheathes at the base. We have grown this plant for four years (a winter low of 8 degrees F during that time), and it has been fine with no special siting or winter mulch. My theory is that since L. aurea has a wide range, that some of the early material into the US was from a tropical part of its range. As Mark Twain once said, "Rumors of my demise have been greatly exaggerated."...ditto Lycoris aurea. Thoughts? Tony Avent Plant Delights Nursery @ Juniper Level Botanic Garden 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F USDA Hardiness Zone 7b email tony@plantdelights.com website http://www.plantdelights.com phone 919 772-4794 fax 919 772-4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least three times" - Avent James Waddick wrote: > Dear Adam et al, > This is an interesting species. According to the best I can > find, this species is endemic to Upper Burma and like all ssp of L. > aurea sub- tropical in growth demands. In my experience and > understanding all L. aurea are extremely frost tender and if the > winter green foliage (which is the most succulent in the genus) is > exposed to even light freezes it will collapse and bloom is > compromised. > > I think that anyone growing a plant with this label and in > your Zonel has a misidentified plant. > > Your " L. a surgens" could be any of various yellow flowered > species - the most likely is of course L. chinensis, or L. longituba > var flava or a hybrid of these two. > > The true L. aurea has the remains of its leaf bases still > prominent at the base of the scape. > Leaves produced in autumn. > Leaves are the largest of any species over 2 feet long, 1 > inch wide and distinctly succulent. > > Does this fit your plant? > > Few people are able to bloom the true species north of Zone 8 or 9. > > Best Jim W. > > > >> I note that L. aurea v. surgens, however is setting seed. >> > > From arlen.jose@verizon.net Tue Sep 4 16:57:44 2007 Message-Id: From: "arlen jose" Subject: Arum Date: Tue, 04 Sep 2007 16:58:24 -0400 From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Tue Sep 4 18:00:21 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Lycoris aurea var. surgens ?? Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 16:58:58 -0500 Dear Kelly, Adam, Tony and all, There is much to learn here. I just did a check of the newest Flora of China version of L. aurea. They do not recognize L. a. surgens at all. and they indicate a distribution including India, Indonesia, Japan, Laos, Myanmar, Pakistan, Thailand, Vietnam as well as Chinese provinces as far north as Gansu, Shaanxi and Hubei and south to Yunnan and Guangdong. None of these are remarkably temperate ( nor is Guizhou). Obviously a wide range of climates and needs. The bulbs I imported all came from Hangzhou in southern Zheijiang Province a warm spot in the range. Regarding freeze/frost damage. I grew these bulbs in a frost free greenhouse without problem, but in a cold frame they fared very poorly. I suppose keeping them dry and free of extra humidity (as Kelly does) could increase their frost resistance. We all know that provenance has been little appreciated. We'd love to get bulbs from as far north as they grow naturally, but I do not know of any sources. As an aside, L. aurea is not really a triploid, but various 'cytoraces' exist with chromosome numbers of at least 12, 13, 14 , 15, and 16 (and there may be others). The diploids should be fertile, but the aneuploids are likely sterile. Kelly I am dubious of Chen Yi's L. shaanxiensis. I have tried them repeatedly, but they have not done well. Since she sells a variety of strange names like pink aurea, white aurea etc, I have doubts about all her names. I have a couple of what I think are the real thing, but they are not vigorous. I am working on that. Yes I wish I could reconnect with Lycoris interests in China and I constantly try new sources-unsuccessfully, alas. More food for thought. Best Jim W. >Jim: > >We have also heard about the tenderness of Lycoris aurea for years and >had shied away from trying it. Several years ago, I saw a collection of >Lycoris aurea at Duke Gardens that Paul Jones had made in China. It had >grown for several years and flowered well there. We later obtained >plants that originated in Guizhou, China under the name L. aurea. When >they flowered, they perfectly keyed to L. aurea, which is the only >species whose flower stalk emerges with old leaf sheathes at the base. >We have grown this plant for four years (a winter low of 8 degrees F >during that time), and it has been fine with no special siting or winter >mulch. My theory is that since L. aurea has a wide range, that some of >the early material into the US was from a tropical part of its range. >As Mark Twain once said, "Rumors of my demise have been greatly >exaggerated."...ditto Lycoris aurea. Thoughts? > >Tony Avent >Plant Delights Nursery @ >Juniper Level Botanic Garden >9241 Sauls Road >Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA >Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F >Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F >USDA Hardiness Zone 7b >email tony@plantdelights.com >website http://www.plantdelights.com >phone 919 772-4794 >fax 919 772-4752 >"I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at >least three times" - Avent > > > >James Waddick wrote: >> Dear Adam et al, >> This is an interesting species. According to the best I can >> find, this species is endemic to Upper Burma and like all ssp of L. >> aurea sub- tropical in growth demands. In my experience and >> understanding all L. aurea are extremely frost tender and if the >> winter green foliage (which is the most succulent in the genus) is >> exposed to even light freezes it will collapse and bloom is >> compromised. >> >> I think that anyone growing a plant with this label and in >> your Zonel has a misidentified plant. >> >> Your " L. a surgens" could be any of various yellow flowered >> species - the most likely is of course L. chinensis, or L. longituba >> var flava or a hybrid of these two. >> >> The true L. aurea has the remains of its leaf bases still >> prominent at the base of the scape. >> Leaves produced in autumn. >> Leaves are the largest of any species over 2 feet long, 1 > > inch wide and distinctly succulent. >> >> Does this fit your plant? >> >> Few people are able to bloom the true species north of Zone 8 or 9. >> >> Best Jim W. >> >> >> >>> I note that L. aurea v. surgens, however is setting seed. >>> >> >> >_______________________________________________ >pbs mailing list >pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From tony@plantdelights.com Tue Sep 4 18:29:55 2007 Message-Id: <46DDDC63.60907@plantdelights.com> From: Tony Avent Subject: Lycoris aurea var. surgens ?? Date: Tue, 04 Sep 2007 18:29:55 -0400 Jim: Up until last year, we had grown these Lycoris aurea in beds that stayed relatively dry due to tree roots, but were still exposed to our normal precipitation. Last fall, I planted several in a bog and surprisingly they also overwintered fine (only 15 degrees F, but at these temps for 6+ nights). They are now in flower, so I can only assume that winter dry doesn't appear to be all that necessary. Many of the Guizhou plants have a prominent dark red-purple dorsal strip on the leaves. It is our intent to select a superb clone and have it propagated by tissue culture. Lycoris aurea has proved very fertile and we have grown quite a few from seed. It is our intent to select a superb clone and have it tissue cultured. As a side note, we have just received the first batch of Lycoris straminea from tissue culture. They will now be grown in ground beds for at least one season until they are large enough to sell. These are bulbs that we purchased from Jim's original imports from China. Tony Avent Plant Delights Nursery @ Juniper Level Botanic Garden 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F USDA Hardiness Zone 7b email tony@plantdelights.com website http://www.plantdelights.com phone 919 772-4794 fax 919 772-4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least three times" - Avent James Waddick wrote: > Dear Kelly, Adam, Tony and all, > There is much to learn here. > I just did a check of the newest Flora of China version of > L. aurea. They do not recognize L. a. surgens at all. and they > indicate a distribution including India, Indonesia, Japan, Laos, > Myanmar, Pakistan, Thailand, Vietnam as well as Chinese provinces as > far north as Gansu, Shaanxi and Hubei and south to Yunnan and > Guangdong. None of these are remarkably temperate ( nor is Guizhou). > > Obviously a wide range of climates and needs. > > The bulbs I imported all came from Hangzhou in southern > Zheijiang Province a warm spot in the range. > > Regarding freeze/frost damage. I grew these bulbs in a frost > free greenhouse without problem, but in a cold frame they fared very > poorly. I suppose keeping them dry and free of extra humidity (as > Kelly does) could increase their frost resistance. > > We all know that provenance has been little appreciated. We'd > love to get bulbs from as far north as they grow naturally, but I do > not know of any sources. > > As an aside, L. aurea is not really a triploid, but various > 'cytoraces' exist with chromosome numbers of at least 12, 13, 14 , > 15, and 16 (and there may be others). The diploids should be fertile, > but the aneuploids are likely sterile. > > Kelly I am dubious of Chen Yi's L. shaanxiensis. I have tried > them repeatedly, but they have not done well. Since she sells a > variety of strange names like pink aurea, white aurea etc, I have > doubts about all her names. I have a couple of what I think are the > real thing, but they are not vigorous. I am working on that. > > Yes I wish I could reconnect with Lycoris interests in China > and I constantly try new sources-unsuccessfully, alas. > > More food for thought. Best Jim W. > > > > >> Jim: >> >> We have also heard about the tenderness of Lycoris aurea for years and >> had shied away from trying it. Several years ago, I saw a collection of >> Lycoris aurea at Duke Gardens that Paul Jones had made in China. It had >> grown for several years and flowered well there. We later obtained >> plants that originated in Guizhou, China under the name L. aurea. When >> they flowered, they perfectly keyed to L. aurea, which is the only >> species whose flower stalk emerges with old leaf sheathes at the base. >> We have grown this plant for four years (a winter low of 8 degrees F >> during that time), and it has been fine with no special siting or winter >> mulch. My theory is that since L. aurea has a wide range, that some of >> the early material into the US was from a tropical part of its range. >> As Mark Twain once said, "Rumors of my demise have been greatly >> exaggerated."...ditto Lycoris aurea. Thoughts? >> >> Tony Avent >> Plant Delights Nursery @ >> Juniper Level Botanic Garden >> 9241 Sauls Road >> Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA >> Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F >> Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F >> USDA Hardiness Zone 7b >> email tony@plantdelights.com >> website http://www.plantdelights.com >> phone 919 772-4794 >> fax 919 772-4752 >> "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at >> least three times" - Avent >> >> >> >> James Waddick wrote: >> >>> Dear Adam et al, >>> This is an interesting species. According to the best I can >>> find, this species is endemic to Upper Burma and like all ssp of L. >>> aurea sub- tropical in growth demands. In my experience and >>> understanding all L. aurea are extremely frost tender and if the >>> winter green foliage (which is the most succulent in the genus) is >>> exposed to even light freezes it will collapse and bloom is >>> compromised. >>> >>> I think that anyone growing a plant with this label and in >>> your Zonel has a misidentified plant. >>> >>> Your " L. a surgens" could be any of various yellow flowered >>> species - the most likely is of course L. chinensis, or L. longituba >>> var flava or a hybrid of these two. >>> >>> The true L. aurea has the remains of its leaf bases still >>> prominent at the base of the scape. >>> Leaves produced in autumn. >>> Leaves are the largest of any species over 2 feet long, 1 >>> >> > inch wide and distinctly succulent. >> >>> Does this fit your plant? >>> >>> Few people are able to bloom the true species north of Zone 8 or 9. >>> >>> Best Jim W. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> I note that L. aurea v. surgens, however is setting seed. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> pbs mailing list >> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki >> > > > From ezeizabotgard@hotmail.com Wed Sep 5 11:21:14 2007 Message-Id: From: Alberto Castillo Subject: Theories - Late Summer bulbs(Lycoris), rain etc.? Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 15:21:13 +0000 c> Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711> USA> Ph. 816-746-1949> Zone 5 Record low -23F> Summer 100F +> > _______________________________________________> pbs mailing list> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki _________________________________________________________________ Descubre Live.com - tu propia página de inicio, personalizada para ver rápidamente todo lo que te interesa en un mismo sitio. http://www.live.com/getstarted From wpoulsen@pacbell.net Wed Sep 5 13:56:58 2007 Message-Id: <7af0f72c5bba5f6fa6990089510e3405@pacbell.net> From: Lee Poulsen Subject: Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 10:56:56 -0700 Along with some oporanthous bulbs such as a Lycoris x albiflora that is slightly tinged with a hint of pink, and several Amaryllis (or possibly Amarygias) of various colors, I had all of my pink Rhodophiala bifidas bloom the past couple of weeks and none of the red ones have bloomed (yet), including those in a large pot of mixed colors (reds and pinks) from seeds I think Alberto Castillo sent out to a BX a number of years ago. Does anyone know why that might be? (Especially since almost all of the pink ones have now wilted, possibly because of this ridiculous heat wave we've had that ended this morning. Yet there isn't even a sign of scape tips emerging from the red flowered ones. Thus, the red blooming will be separated from the pink blooming by a month or even more.) --Lee Poulsen Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a From rarebulbs@suddenlink.net Wed Sep 5 14:31:25 2007 Message-Id: <001d01c7efea$236cb120$6f1c6f4b@DJ9SK221> From: "Diana Chapman" Subject: Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 11:25:29 -0700 Hi Lee: Yes mine do the same thing, although I have two different clones of the pink R. bifida, and one has already bloomed, while the other is just sending up buds. Honestly, I can't see why the pink one is called R. bifida, since it seems quite a bit different from the red one in form, being much smaller and daintier, tepals more pointed, striated, etc., but I call it R. bifida Pink Form because everyone else does. The other clone I have was collected from the Buenos Aires region and is also a slightly darker pink - this is the one that blooms earlier. Diana Telos Rare Bulbs www.telosrarebulbs.com > Along with some oporanthous bulbs such as a Lycoris x albiflora that is > slightly tinged with a hint of pink, and several Amaryllis (or possibly > Amarygias) of various colors, I had all of my pink Rhodophiala bifidas > bloom the past couple of weeks and none of the red ones have bloomed > (yet), including those in a large pot of mixed colors (reds and pinks) > from seeds I think Alberto Castillo sent out to a BX a number of years > ago. Does anyone know why that might be? > (Especially since almost all of the pink ones have now wilted, possibly > because of this ridiculous heat wave we've had that ended this morning. > Yet there isn't even a sign of scape tips emerging from the red > flowered ones. Thus, the red blooming will be separated from the pink > blooming by a month or even more.) > > --Lee Poulsen > Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a > From rpries@sbcglobal.net Wed Sep 5 14:39:06 2007 Message-Id: <333423.1492.qm@web81913.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: Robt R Pries Subject: Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 11:39:05 -0700 (PDT) Diana; I was rsearching the original descriptions of Rhodolphiala and it appears that The pink form which is named Rhodolphiala bifida var. spathacea was elevated to the rank of species(Rhodolphiala spathacea) I have assumed that it was again lowered by another auther back to variety because everyone seems to refer to it as a variety and not a species but I have not found any reference to it being reduced back to a species. Of course the other option is that hardly anyone accepted the original elevation to species. It does make one wonder it it really should be separated since it would appear that in nature there would be a temporal separation of gene pools. --- Diana Chapman wrote: > Hi Lee: > > Yes mine do the same thing, although I have two > different clones of the pink > R. bifida, and one has already bloomed, while the > other is just sending up > buds. Honestly, I can't see why the pink one is > called R. bifida, since it > seems quite a bit different from the red one in > form, being much smaller and > daintier, tepals more pointed, striated, etc., but I > call it R. bifida Pink > Form because everyone else does. The other clone I > have was collected from > the Buenos Aires region and is also a slightly > darker pink - this is the one > that blooms earlier. > > Diana > Telos Rare Bulbs > www.telosrarebulbs.com > > > Along with some oporanthous bulbs such as a > Lycoris x albiflora that is > > slightly tinged with a hint of pink, and several > Amaryllis (or possibly > > Amarygias) of various colors, I had all of my pink > Rhodophiala bifidas > > bloom the past couple of weeks and none of the red > ones have bloomed > > (yet), including those in a large pot of mixed > colors (reds and pinks) > > from seeds I think Alberto Castillo sent out to a > BX a number of years > > ago. Does anyone know why that might be? > > (Especially since almost all of the pink ones have > now wilted, possibly > > because of this ridiculous heat wave we've had > that ended this morning. > > Yet there isn't even a sign of scape tips emerging > from the red > > flowered ones. Thus, the red blooming will be > separated from the pink > > blooming by a month or even more.) > > > > --Lee Poulsen > > Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a > > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From rpries@sbcglobal.net Wed Sep 5 14:42:39 2007 Message-Id: <428549.76612.qm@web81907.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: Robt R Pries Subject: Lycoris radiata?? Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 11:42:38 -0700 (PDT) All this talk of Lycoris and mine have gotten their third flush of bloom. This time some radiata hybrids are blooming. The drought seems to have decreased bloom dramatically but still a sample of everything seems to have bloomed this season. I love these plants but I have trouble remembering the subtle differences in color especially when they don’t bloom at the same time. Last month I had a radiate with coral red flowers bloom. It looked a different color to me than the normal radiata and was certainly very early. Now a two more radiatas have come into bloom one is a pink color and the other an orange-red different then a pure red. I do not have a good camera to use to take their pictures but I am not sure I can attach picture to this discussion group. The picture I have is not good enough to be immortalized on the wikki but just shows the color variation. I am curious if others have seen this type of variation within Lycoris radiata. From tony@plantdelights.com Wed Sep 5 15:30:46 2007 Message-Id: <46DF03E7.5080208@plantdelights.com> From: Tony Avent Subject: Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2007 15:30:47 -0400 Diana: We got our original Rhodophiala bifida carmine pink from seed sent in by Alberto Castillo several years ago. Our original plants set seed and we now have about 750 flowering size 3-year old plants in ground beds. Most are exactly like the typical red R. bifida except for some oddballs with narrow petals, and some shorter than normal. For us typical R. bifida flowers in early-mid September. The first of these carmine pink seedlings flowered in late July-early August...probably about 10 plants. A few flowered in mid-August...probably another 10 plants, and the majority are just beginning to flower now. We get a small percentage of a stunning ruby-red flowered forms from these seed also. There is obviously a great deal of variability in color, form, and bloom time. Once again, a thanks to Alberto for sharing these new genetics. Tony Avent Plant Delights Nursery @ Juniper Level Botanic Garden 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F USDA Hardiness Zone 7b email tony@plantdelights.com website http://www.plantdelights.com phone 919 772-4794 fax 919 772-4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least three times" - Avent Diana Chapman wrote: > Hi Lee: > > Yes mine do the same thing, although I have two different clones of the pink > R. bifida, and one has already bloomed, while the other is just sending up > buds. Honestly, I can't see why the pink one is called R. bifida, since it > seems quite a bit different from the red one in form, being much smaller and > daintier, tepals more pointed, striated, etc., but I call it R. bifida Pink > Form because everyone else does. The other clone I have was collected from > the Buenos Aires region and is also a slightly darker pink - this is the one > that blooms earlier. > > Diana > Telos Rare Bulbs > www.telosrarebulbs.com > > >> Along with some oporanthous bulbs such as a Lycoris x albiflora that is >> slightly tinged with a hint of pink, and several Amaryllis (or possibly >> Amarygias) of various colors, I had all of my pink Rhodophiala bifidas >> bloom the past couple of weeks and none of the red ones have bloomed >> (yet), including those in a large pot of mixed colors (reds and pinks) >> from seeds I think Alberto Castillo sent out to a BX a number of years >> ago. Does anyone know why that might be? >> (Especially since almost all of the pink ones have now wilted, possibly >> because of this ridiculous heat wave we've had that ended this morning. >> Yet there isn't even a sign of scape tips emerging from the red >> flowered ones. Thus, the red blooming will be separated from the pink >> blooming by a month or even more.) >> >> --Lee Poulsen >> Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > From prallen2@peoplepc.com Wed Sep 5 15:48:41 2007 Message-Id: <13709882.1189021721177.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net> From: patty allen Subject: Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 15:48:40 -0400 (EDT) Lee, I live in southeast Texas and my pink Rhodophiala bifidas are on their third cycle of bloom since the second week of August. The more mature bulbs send up at least one bloom stalk and a week or so later will send up a second. My pinks range from a pale lavender-pink to a dark rose-red pink. Vary in height from about 12" to over 18".The petal on some twist and flare , others stand straight out to the side of the stalk, some have short petal , some have long petals . I have had 3 bulbs that threw up 2 bloom stalks with six blossoms each and I harvested 12 seed pods from them. These pink oxbloods have been growing for me since 2002 and multiply like crazy, beside the seed set.I have several thousand pinks in all shades of pink and it is just a sight to behold when they are blooming! One tiny maroon-red is about 6" tall and has been plucked from all the others to be evaluated. I have about 10,000 of our hardy Texas red oxbloods blooming right now and if the cooler and wetter weather keeps up for a while, they will probably still be blooming by the end of this month. Patty Allen -----Original Message----- >From: Lee Poulsen >Sent: Sep 5, 2007 1:56 PM >To: Pacific Bulb Society >Subject: [pbs] Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time > >Along with some oporanthous bulbs such as a Lycoris x albiflora that is >slightly tinged with a hint of pink, and several Amaryllis (or possibly >Amarygias) of various colors, I had all of my pink Rhodophiala bifidas >bloom the past couple of weeks and none of the red ones have bloomed >(yet), including those in a large pot of mixed colors (reds and pinks) >from seeds I think Alberto Castillo sent out to a BX a number of years >ago. Does anyone know why that might be? >(Especially since almost all of the pink ones have now wilted, possibly >because of this ridiculous heat wave we've had that ended this morning. >Yet there isn't even a sign of scape tips emerging from the red >flowered ones. Thus, the red blooming will be separated from the pink >blooming by a month or even more.) > >--Lee Poulsen >Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a > >_______________________________________________ >pbs mailing list >pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki ________________________________________ PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Wed Sep 5 17:26:56 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Ipheion 'Jessie' Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 15:46:22 -0500 Dear all, There has been some comments earlier particularly by the late Dave KArnstadt about a new Ipheion Cv 'Jessie'. I am wondering if anyone else grows it and has some thoughts about how it does for them. It is said to be an 'improved' rich blue. Thanks Jim W. -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From rpries@sbcglobal.net Wed Sep 5 17:37:11 2007 Message-Id: <939577.23581.qm@web81901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: Robt R Pries Subject: Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 14:37:10 -0700 (PDT) Tony; It has been alledged that the common red flowered Rhodolphiala across the south is a sterile triploid. Supposedly it is also a sturdier plant because of this. Do you see any of the red flowered forms setting seed and are they really different in vigor from the red-flowered plants that came from you pink flowered seed? --- Tony Avent wrote: > Diana: > > We got our original Rhodophiala bifida carmine pink > from seed sent in by > Alberto Castillo several years ago. Our original > plants set seed and we > now have about 750 flowering size 3-year old plants > in ground beds. > Most are exactly like the typical red R. bifida > except for some oddballs > with narrow petals, and some shorter than normal. > For us typical R. > bifida flowers in early-mid September. The first of > these carmine pink > seedlings flowered in late July-early > August...probably about 10 > plants. A few flowered in mid-August...probably > another 10 plants, and > the majority are just beginning to flower now. We > get a small > percentage of a stunning ruby-red flowered forms > from these seed also. > There is obviously a great deal of variability in > color, form, and bloom > time. Once again, a thanks to Alberto for sharing > these new genetics. > > > Tony Avent > Plant Delights Nursery @ > Juniper Level Botanic Garden > 9241 Sauls Road > Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA > Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F > Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F > USDA Hardiness Zone 7b > email tony@plantdelights.com > website http://www.plantdelights.com > phone 919 772-4794 > fax 919 772-4752 > "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it > myself...at least three times" - Avent > > > > Diana Chapman wrote: > > Hi Lee: > > > > Yes mine do the same thing, although I have two > different clones of the pink > > R. bifida, and one has already bloomed, while the > other is just sending up > > buds. Honestly, I can't see why the pink one is > called R. bifida, since it > > seems quite a bit different from the red one in > form, being much smaller and > > daintier, tepals more pointed, striated, etc., but > I call it R. bifida Pink > > Form because everyone else does. The other clone > I have was collected from > > the Buenos Aires region and is also a slightly > darker pink - this is the one > > that blooms earlier. > > > > Diana > > Telos Rare Bulbs > > www.telosrarebulbs.com > > > > > >> Along with some oporanthous bulbs such as a > Lycoris x albiflora that is > >> slightly tinged with a hint of pink, and several > Amaryllis (or possibly > >> Amarygias) of various colors, I had all of my > pink Rhodophiala bifidas > >> bloom the past couple of weeks and none of the > red ones have bloomed > >> (yet), including those in a large pot of mixed > colors (reds and pinks) > >> from seeds I think Alberto Castillo sent out to a > BX a number of years > >> ago. Does anyone know why that might be? > >> (Especially since almost all of the pink ones > have now wilted, possibly > >> because of this ridiculous heat wave we've had > that ended this morning. > >> Yet there isn't even a sign of scape tips > emerging from the red > >> flowered ones. Thus, the red blooming will be > separated from the pink > >> blooming by a month or even more.) > >> > >> --Lee Poulsen > >> Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a > >> > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > pbs mailing list > > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From carlobal@netzero.net Wed Sep 5 17:55:13 2007 Message-Id: <20070905.175341.3879.1@webmail12.vgs.untd.com> From: "carlobal@netzero.net" Subject: Ipheion 'Jessie' Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 21:53:41 GMT Jane had it in her list (very limited). I got one bulb, currently residing in a pot while the other Ipheions went into the ground. We'll see... Carlo A. Balistrieri The Gardens at Turtle Point Tuxedo Park, NY 10987 Zone 6 (845.351.2049) Visit: www.botanicalgardening.com From msittner@mcn.org Wed Sep 5 18:01:30 2007 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.2.20070905143622.04456cc0@mail.mcn.org> From: Mary Sue Ittner Subject: In bloom, but Rhodophiala not Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2007 15:00:43 -0700 Hi, I've given up on getting any Rhodophiala bifida to bloom for me. No luck in pots, no luck in the ground. And I've been trying for a very long time. One year there was a freak bloom that gave me hope, but that has been it. The ones in deep pots produce leaves. The ones in the ground may or may not exist anymore. We will be going on a trip to Australia in two weeks so am hoping some of the fall blooming things I'll get to see before we go. My Nerine sarniensis hybrids are having a good year although the spikes are unusually long. The flowers are so lovely and shiny! And Gladiolus carmineus is popping into bloom all over my garden. I have some early Oxalis in bloom and a Haemanthus grown from seed from Doug Westfall that is going to bloom. It was supposed to be H. albiflos, but I think it is probably a hybrid instead. And the Cyclamen are spectacular. It's been an unusually warm summer for us. People are raving about all the vegetables that they have been able to harvest so as always it is interesting to watch for what does better and what does worse as the weather changes. I have a couple of spikes on Cyrtanthus (one hybrid) and one on C. sanguineus that mostly got wiped out by the Narcissus bulb fly so I was surprised to see the start of a spike in the middle of some of the little offsets I saved when I tossed the bigger ones eaten by the grubs. So I guess there are some compensations for those of us not easily able to grow Lycoris and Rhodophiala. Still no Crocus yet however, but I can hope. One pleasure a couple of weeks ago was a bloom from a Scadoxus membraneus. Patty Colville and I shared a few seeds from Henry Pauw in South Africa in 2001 that I had labeled something else. I don't know how Patty did with hers, but I ended up with one plant that has since increased. Last year it bloomed for the first time and the flower bloomed in the leaves. I took a picture of it with me to South Africa hoping to confirm its identity and Cameron McMaster said it looked deformed. His wife on the other hand said something kinder like sometimes young plants bloom better in subsequent years and that has been true this year. I thought it absolutely charming this year. The foliage once again hugs the ground whereas the plants I grew from Doug's seed of the same species have foliage that is taller. The blooms of the plant from Henry's seed were short again, but tall enough to be seen and a very pleasing combination with the leaves. Mary Sue From wpoulsen@pacbell.net Wed Sep 5 18:45:42 2007 Message-Id: <04a59c004bcc0c7de51bc6d17c1f4125@pacbell.net> From: Lee Poulsen Subject: In bloom, but Rhodophiala not Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 15:45:30 -0700 Yet another reason to have the word 'oporanthous' AND start marking more of my plants as this. I knew there was a gladiolus I have that bloomed at this time, but usually all I find when I start bringing all my winter-growers out of storage in the fall is the dead deformed scapes that tried growing in a tight situation. I keep forgetting to mark it so that in late spring, when I start storing all of them for the summer (and have completely forgotten about G. carmineus's blooming in late summer), I can put that one in my oporanthous bulb area I described in a previous email. Thanks for noting this one, Mary Sue. Also, thanks for commenting that Narcissus bulb fly grubs also attack Cyrtanthus. We get them sometimes and they mostly attack Narcissus. But I never would have guessed that they would attack Cyrtanthus, some of which I have mysteriously lost in the past and now realize showed the same symptoms as Narcissus do. --Lee Poulsen Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a On Sep 5, 2007, at 3:00 PM, Mary Sue Ittner wrote: > And Gladiolus > carmineus is popping into bloom all over my garden. > I have a > couple of spikes on Cyrtanthus (one hybrid) and one on C. sanguineus > that > mostly got wiped out by the Narcissus bulb fly so I was surprised to > see the start of a spike in the middle of some of the little offsets > I > saved when I tossed the bigger ones eaten by the grubs. From janemcgary@earthlink.net Wed Sep 5 21:29:53 2007 Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.0.20070905183003.016b3e58@mail.earthlink.net> From: Jane McGary Subject: Ipheion 'Jessie' Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2007 18:32:54 -0700 Jim Waddick asked about this new cultivar. One bulb given me by Wim de Goede 3 years ago increased very well, and I offered it as a "bonus" on orders this year. I cannot sell it because it is under Grower's Rights in the Netherlands. 'Jessie' is indeed a remarkable color, a real gentian blue, very like the color of Commelina dianthifolia. It is a small plant, about half the size of the Ipheion uniflorum cultivars more widely grown. It was selected by Tony Hall of Kew and named for his late sister, Jessie. I don't know how cold-hardy this plant is, since I grow it in an unheated frame where the temperature never goes below about 20 degrees F. However, it is really pretty. Jane McGary Northwestern Oregon, USA From tony@plantdelights.com Thu Sep 6 07:43:18 2007 Message-Id: <46DFE7D7.2030007@plantdelights.com> From: Tony Avent Subject: Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2007 07:43:19 -0400 Bob: I also had heard about the sterility of the southern clone of R. bifida and bought into that idea until ours started setting seed a couple of years ago after we added more rhodophiala genetics to the garden. It seems that they had just been looking for love in all the wrong places. Tony Avent Plant Delights Nursery @ Juniper Level Botanic Garden 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F USDA Hardiness Zone 7b email tony@plantdelights.com website http://www.plantdelights.com phone 919 772-4794 fax 919 772-4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least three times" - Avent Robt R Pries wrote: > Tony; It has been alledged that the common red > flowered Rhodolphiala across the south is a sterile > triploid. Supposedly it is also a sturdier plant > because of this. Do you see any of the red flowered > forms setting seed and are they really different in > vigor from the red-flowered plants that came from you > pink flowered seed? > > > --- Tony Avent wrote: > > >> Diana: >> >> We got our original Rhodophiala bifida carmine pink >> from seed sent in by >> Alberto Castillo several years ago. Our original >> plants set seed and we >> now have about 750 flowering size 3-year old plants >> in ground beds. >> Most are exactly like the typical red R. bifida >> except for some oddballs >> with narrow petals, and some shorter than normal. >> For us typical R. >> bifida flowers in early-mid September. The first of >> these carmine pink >> seedlings flowered in late July-early >> August...probably about 10 >> plants. A few flowered in mid-August...probably >> another 10 plants, and >> the majority are just beginning to flower now. We >> get a small >> percentage of a stunning ruby-red flowered forms >> from these seed also. >> There is obviously a great deal of variability in >> color, form, and bloom >> time. Once again, a thanks to Alberto for sharing >> these new genetics. >> >> >> Tony Avent >> Plant Delights Nursery @ >> Juniper Level Botanic Garden >> 9241 Sauls Road >> Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA >> Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F >> Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F >> USDA Hardiness Zone 7b >> email tony@plantdelights.com >> website http://www.plantdelights.com >> phone 919 772-4794 >> fax 919 772-4752 >> "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it >> myself...at least three times" - Avent >> >> >> >> Diana Chapman wrote: >> >>> Hi Lee: >>> >>> Yes mine do the same thing, although I have two >>> >> different clones of the pink >> >>> R. bifida, and one has already bloomed, while the >>> >> other is just sending up >> >>> buds. Honestly, I can't see why the pink one is >>> >> called R. bifida, since it >> >>> seems quite a bit different from the red one in >>> >> form, being much smaller and >> >>> daintier, tepals more pointed, striated, etc., but >>> >> I call it R. bifida Pink >> >>> Form because everyone else does. The other clone >>> >> I have was collected from >> >>> the Buenos Aires region and is also a slightly >>> >> darker pink - this is the one >> >>> that blooms earlier. >>> >>> Diana >>> Telos Rare Bulbs >>> www.telosrarebulbs.com >>> >>> >>> >>>> Along with some oporanthous bulbs such as a >>>> >> Lycoris x albiflora that is >> >>>> slightly tinged with a hint of pink, and several >>>> >> Amaryllis (or possibly >> >>>> Amarygias) of various colors, I had all of my >>>> >> pink Rhodophiala bifidas >> >>>> bloom the past couple of weeks and none of the >>>> >> red ones have bloomed >> >>>> (yet), including those in a large pot of mixed >>>> >> colors (reds and pinks) >> >>>> from seeds I think Alberto Castillo sent out to a >>>> >> BX a number of years >> >>>> ago. Does anyone know why that might be? >>>> (Especially since almost all of the pink ones >>>> >> have now wilted, possibly >> >>>> because of this ridiculous heat wave we've had >>>> >> that ended this morning. >> >>>> Yet there isn't even a sign of scape tips >>>> >> emerging from the red >> >>>> flowered ones. Thus, the red blooming will be >>>> >> separated from the pink >> >>>> blooming by a month or even more.) >>>> >>>> --Lee Poulsen >>>> Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> pbs mailing list >>> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >>> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >>> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> pbs mailing list >> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > From tony@plantdelights.com Thu Sep 6 12:28:51 2007 Message-Id: <46E02AC5.1070605@plantdelights.com> From: Tony Avent Subject: Ipheion 'Jessie' Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2007 12:28:53 -0400 Jim: Ipheion 'Jessie' has been out for year here in the garden and came through the winter fine. Tony Avent Plant Delights Nursery @ Juniper Level Botanic Garden 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F USDA Hardiness Zone 7b email tony@plantdelights.com website http://www.plantdelights.com phone 919 772-4794 fax 919 772-4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least three times" - Avent Jane McGary wrote: > Jim Waddick asked about this new cultivar. > > One bulb given me by Wim de Goede 3 years ago increased very well, and I > offered it as a "bonus" on orders this year. I cannot sell it because it is > under Grower's Rights in the Netherlands. > > 'Jessie' is indeed a remarkable color, a real gentian blue, very like the > color of Commelina dianthifolia. It is a small plant, about half the size > of the Ipheion uniflorum cultivars more widely grown. It was selected by > Tony Hall of Kew and named for his late sister, Jessie. > > I don't know how cold-hardy this plant is, since I grow it in an unheated > frame where the temperature never goes below about 20 degrees F. However, > it is really pretty. > > Jane McGary > Northwestern Oregon, USA > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > From voltaire@islandnet.com Thu Sep 6 17:03:19 2007 Message-Id: <50BD3A9B-65A3-4DAB-8820-81206E554C0A@islandnet.com> From: Diane Whitehead Subject: Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time in SE Texas Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 14:02:49 -0700 Begin forwarded message: From: patty allen Date: September 5, 2007 12:48:40 PM PDT To: Pacific Bulb Society Subject: Re: [pbs] Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time Reply-To: patty allen Lee, I live in southeast Texas and my pink Rhodophiala bifidas are on their third cycle of bloom since the second week of August. The more mature bulbs send up at least one bloom stalk and a week or so later will send up a second. My pinks range from a pale lavender-pink to a dark rose-red pink. Vary in height from about 12" to over 18".The petal on some twist and flare , others stand straight out to the side of the stalk, some have short petal , some have long petals . I have had 3 bulbs that threw up 2 bloom stalks with six blossoms each and I harvested 12 seed pods from them. These pink oxbloods have been growing for me since 2002 and multiply like crazy, beside the seed set.I have several thousand pinks in all shades of pink and it is just a sight to behold when they are blooming! One tiny maroon-red is about 6" tall and has been plucked from all the others to be evaluated. I have about 10,000 of our hardy Texas red oxbloods blooming right now and if the cooler and wetter weather keeps up for a while, they will probably still be blooming by the end of this month. Patty Allen From jegrace@rose.net Thu Sep 6 18:39:30 2007 Message-Id: <1189118369_46918@mail.rose.net> From: "jegrace" Subject: Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time in SE Texas Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 18:39:23 -0400 Patty, I can only imagine the beauty of that many Rhodophiala blooming at the same time! I have been feeling blessed that 10 of my 20 are in their glory. Our weather is anything but cool, however we had a good bit of rain last week. Jim and Erin Grace Thomasville, GA From robertwerra@pacific.net Thu Sep 6 21:18:03 2007 Message-Id: <000b01c7f0ed$378113f0$ba296ad0@popbob> From: robertwerra@pacific.net Subject: Rhodophyela bifida? Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 18:20:02 -0700 To all, My beautiful oxblood Rhodophiala is in full bloom. It has bloomed every year for 10 years in a semi neglected pot in hot dry inland No. Calif. Interestingly, Mary Sue, a much better gardener, cannot get hers to bloom 40 miles west, on the moist Pacific coast. The label is long gone, but I think it is R. bifida. Sincerely, Bob Werra From prallen2@peoplepc.com Thu Sep 6 21:54:12 2007 Message-Id: <10036175.1189130051972.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net> From: patty allen Subject: Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time in SE Texas Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 21:54:11 -0400 (EDT) Dear Jim and Erin, If you will go to my website: www.bayoucityheirloombulbs.com, I think I have 2 photos of the pinks. One of a variety of colors in a community pot and a photo of an individual bulb blooming. They are something to see!! Maybe I can put up 2-3 photos on the PBS website in a day or two. Thanks for your comments, Patty -----Original Message----- >From: jegrace >Sent: Sep 6, 2007 6:39 PM >To: 'Pacific Bulb Society' >Subject: Re: [pbs] Pink Rhodophiala bifida bloom time in SE Texas > >Patty, > >I can only imagine the beauty of that many Rhodophiala blooming at the same >time! I have been feeling blessed that 10 of my 20 are in their glory. > >Our weather is anything but cool, however we had a good bit of rain last >week. > >Jim and Erin Grace >Thomasville, GA > > >_______________________________________________ >pbs mailing list >pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki ________________________________________ PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com From antennaria@charter.net Thu Sep 6 22:41:32 2007 Message-Id: <490780010.1189132887399.JavaMail.root@fepweb06> From: Subject: Roscoea cautleoides - late bloom redux Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 19:41:27 -0700 Whether it is spelled Roscoea cautleyoides or cautleoides, the latter seemingly the right way, here is the plant flowering in late summmer/fall, as it does every year, in addition to the main spring flowering. I still think it looks like a Monsanto corn experiment gone awry... ugly! I also shifted the camera angle to show that it isn't nearly as isolated with too much room as has been suggested... photo taken 09-06-2007. http://www.plantbuzz.com/buzz/2007/Roscoea_cautleoides_fall_07.jpg Mark McDonough Massachusetts, near the New Hampshire border, USDA Zone 5 antennaria@charter.net From jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Thu Sep 6 23:14:17 2007 Message-Id: <000301c7f0fd$525717a0$2f01a8c0@Library> From: "Jim McKenney" Subject: crickets #)($%&$$#&*(%! Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 23:15:18 -0400 In the earlier post on this topic I blamed crickets. I got home late tonight and went out into the garden with a flashlight to check the colchicum. Evidently I blamed the wrong critter. Tonight I found the flowers covered with clusters of pill bugs (aka sow bugs and lots of other names; they are terrestrial crustaceans of the order Isopoda). I don't really know anything about the eating habits of sow bugs. Most sources describe them as eating dead vegetation. Maybe the pill bugs were only eating nectar. Something is chewing and eating the tepals of the colchicum right down to stubs. Ideas, anyone? Jim McKenney jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Montgomery County, Maryland, USA, USDA zone 7, where bottle gentians are blooming. My Virtual Maryland Garden http://www.jimmckenney.com BLOG! http://mcwort.blogspot.com/ Webmaster Potomac Valley Chapter, NARGS Editor PVC Bulletin http://www.pvcnargs.org Webmaster Potomac Lily Society http://www.potomaclilysociety.org From jegrace@rose.net Thu Sep 6 23:33:44 2007 Message-Id: <1189135998_49895@mail.rose.net> From: "jegrace" Subject: crickets #)($%&$$#&*(%! Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 23:33:12 -0400 Most of the info I have found on pill bugs - internet and otherwise - has been that they only eat dead vegetation I have personally watched the little buggers lined up munching on iris rizomes like they were ears of corn. You could see the marks as the group of them chowed down. (I was out with a flashlight and watched them eat) I have lost seedlings to them and most especially tender new hosta growth. I have a major infestation of the critters, which are more closely related to shrimp than to the usual garden pests. All I can say is from person experience- I know that although they are meant to be scavangers of dead and rotting material, they love tender new plant growth and will go after and destroy it. Jim and Erin Grace Thomasville, GA -----Original Message----- From: pbs-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org [mailto:pbs-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Jim McKenney Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2007 11:15 PM To: 'Pacific Bulb Society' Subject: Re: [pbs] crickets #)($%&$$#&*(%! In the earlier post on this topic I blamed crickets. I got home late tonight and went out into the garden with a flashlight to check the colchicum. Evidently I blamed the wrong critter. Tonight I found the flowers covered with clusters of pill bugs (aka sow bugs and lots of other names; they are terrestrial crustaceans of the order Isopoda). I don't really know anything about the eating habits of sow bugs. Most sources describe them as eating dead vegetation. Maybe the pill bugs were only eating nectar. Something is chewing and eating the tepals of the colchicum right down to stubs. Ideas, anyone? Jim McKenney jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Montgomery County, Maryland, USA, USDA zone 7, where bottle gentians are blooming. My Virtual Maryland Garden http://www.jimmckenney.com BLOG! http://mcwort.blogspot.com/ Webmaster Potomac Valley Chapter, NARGS Editor PVC Bulletin http://www.pvcnargs.org Webmaster Potomac Lily Society http://www.potomaclilysociety.org _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From jshields@indy.net Fri Sep 7 08:20:48 2007 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20070907081323.02719e38@pop.indy.net> From: "J.E. Shields" Subject: Rhodophyela bifida? Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 08:20:37 -0400 Hi all, Rhodophiala bifida must need fairly extreme conditions to bloom. They probably need hot summers and cold winters, neither of which Mary Sue has at her current home. I have some R. bifida bulbs from Texas, and they survive outdoors here in at least one unprotected spot year-round. We got some rain today, so maybe they will bloom soon. I don't think the R. bifida need dry summers, since we often have a lot of summer rain (just not this year, unfortunately). Our summers are hot and our winters are cold. We have some Lycoris radiata radiata here too, that survive and sometimes bloom, but definitely do not thrive outdoors in the ground. The diploid form of L. radiata does not survive here. At 06:20 PM 9/6/2007 -0700, you wrote: >To all, My beautiful oxblood Rhodophiala is in full bloom. It has bloomed >every year for 10 years in a semi neglected pot in hot dry inland No. >Calif. Interestingly, Mary Sue, a much better gardener, cannot get hers to >bloom 40 miles west, on the moist Pacific coast. The label is long gone, >but I think it is R. bifida. Sincerely, Bob Werra ************************************************* Jim Shields USDA Zone 5 Shields Gardens, Ltd. P.O. Box 92 WWW: http://www.shieldsgardens.com/ Westfield, Indiana 46074, USA Tel. ++1-317-867-3344 or toll-free 1-866-449-3344 in USA From arnold@nj.rr.com Fri Sep 7 08:28:57 2007 Message-Id: <46E143FD.9020108@nj.rr.com> From: Arnold Trachtenberg Subject: crickets #)($%&$$#&*(%! Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 08:28:45 -0400 Jim: The slugs did it! Arnold From aaron_floden@yahoo.com Fri Sep 7 09:10:48 2007 Message-Id: <277623.72258.qm@web34307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: aaron floden Subject: crickets #)($%&$$#&*(%!pillbugs, blister beetles Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 06:10:47 -0700 (PDT) Sounds like the Pillbugs. My experience in Kansas was that roly-poly's were awful. I considered them almost my number one enemy in the first half of the garden season. Early tender growth was consumned immediately, Cyclamen flowers were mostly eaten and only perfect in pots, Iris leaves and rhizomes, Arisaema seedlings, Trillium, Hepatica flowers, etc.. I smashed them when I turned over rocks, leaves, etc. I am a murderer of millions of them, but they were in the wrong place. As to internet and book information they do all say dead material, but I rarely saw them eating anything brown, freshly cut or wilting green vegetation, YES. The only thing worse would be Blister beetles, Epicauta pennsylvanica. These are ferocious summer feeders, starting with Clematis, moving through the delectable Ranunculaceae, onto Baptisia, Solanum(Lycopersicon), Hosta, etc. You can smash them ( I can the cantharadin doesn't bother me) with your fingers and they keep moving. Walk away and five minutes later they have disappeared. Same goes for permethrin sprayed on them, so a smash and permethrin helps a lot. A nice little hand torch once that has been performed is even better, even if it is overkill. Fortunately here in TN I have not seen many, but we do have the large slugs, easily skewered and thrown in the road. Aaron Floden Knoxville, TN > Tonight I found the flowers covered with clusters of > pill bugs (aka sow bugs and lots of > other names; they are terrestrial crustaceans of the > order Isopoda). > > I don't really know anything about the eating habits > of sow bugs. Most > sources describe them as eating dead vegetation. > Maybe the pill bugs were > only eating nectar. > > Ideas, anyone? > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 From prallen2@peoplepc.com Fri Sep 7 10:34:59 2007 Message-Id: <18658301.1189175699028.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net> From: patty allen Subject: Rhodophyela bifida? Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 10:34:58 -0400 (EDT) Jim, Just from my experience of growing the old heirloom Rhodophiala bifida that are so numerous around Central Texas, they do not need extremes of either. I have oxbloods growing in full shade, full sun ,parts of each, dry areas and sunken areas and we don't normally get really cold weather down here in Southeast Texas. This early summer we have experienced hotter weather than we have had in many years. Then we had 4-6 weeks of steady rain and really cooler weather than we normally expect at that time of year, where some of my beds had 4-6" water standing in walkways between the beds, weeks on end. As of this morning, I have 13 beds of oxbloods (from 4' 8' beds to 4' x 32' beds) blooming their heads off. So , I would say that cold winters are not anything the oxbloods need to put on their show. Our Texas bulbs are supposed to be sterile, I have found that is not the case with mine. I had about 230 bulbs set seed last year and the year before. And as was suggested by another post, these have not come from different areas, therefore, different gene pools. They ALL came from the same Central Texas area, whose colonies I'm sure were increased partially, by the same method, seed production. Of course, everyone knows about the spiralling bulblets that twist up and around the mother bulb. I have successfully used my pink oxblood pollen on the Texas reds and vice-versa and now have 2 thriving community pots, of each cross. The pink oxbloods I grow are treated to the same culture as my reds. My particular group of pink oxbloods, not only set seed, but also have the spirally babies coming up from the base of the mother bulb, sometimes as many as 20 to one bulb. Patty -----Original Message----- >From: "J.E. Shields" >Sent: Sep 7, 2007 8:20 AM >To: robertwerra@pacific.net, Pacific Bulb Society >Subject: Re: [pbs] Rhodophyela bifida? > >Hi all, > >Rhodophiala bifida must need fairly extreme conditions to bloom. They >probably need hot summers and cold winters, neither of which Mary Sue has >at her current home. > >I have some R. bifida bulbs from Texas, and they survive outdoors here in >at least one unprotected spot year-round. We got some rain today, so maybe >they will bloom soon. I don't think the R. bifida need dry summers, since >we often have a lot of summer rain (just not this year, >unfortunately). Our summers are hot and our winters are cold. > >We have some Lycoris radiata radiata here too, that survive and sometimes >bloom, but definitely do not thrive outdoors in the ground. The diploid >form of L. radiata does not survive here. > > >At 06:20 PM 9/6/2007 -0700, you wrote: >>To all, My beautiful oxblood Rhodophiala is in full bloom. It has bloomed >>every year for 10 years in a semi neglected pot in hot dry inland No. >>Calif. Interestingly, Mary Sue, a much better gardener, cannot get hers to >>bloom 40 miles west, on the moist Pacific coast. The label is long gone, >>but I think it is R. bifida. Sincerely, Bob Werra > >************************************************* >Jim Shields USDA Zone 5 Shields Gardens, Ltd. >P.O. Box 92 WWW: http://www.shieldsgardens.com/ >Westfield, Indiana 46074, USA >Tel. ++1-317-867-3344 or toll-free 1-866-449-3344 in USA > > >_______________________________________________ >pbs mailing list >pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki ________________________________________ PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com From msittner@mcn.org Fri Sep 7 11:45:26 2007 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.2.20070907082622.02d3ad88@mail.mcn.org> From: Mary Sue Ittner Subject: Rhodophiala bifida Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 08:45:01 -0700 Hi, Patty and I traded some bulbs. She sent me some of her Rhodophiala that are so happy in Central Texas and they are not happy in coastal northern California. I don't even know if they are still here. If Bob Werra can bloom them and I can't, it could be heat in summer they need. I don't know if it cools off at night in Ukiah where Bob lives as much as it does here, but it is definitely hotter during the day. Jim McKenney was amazed when I sent him some pictures of a kite festival one July weekend and he saw people bundled up in jackets and hats (during the day). It generally cools off at night a lot here too (although we've just had a few warm nights.) There aren't a lot of people sitting out around their barbecues outside at night where I live like happened when I lived in Texas. Late afternoon picnics and concerts can turn cool as evening descends and people bring blankets and warm clothes just in case they are needed. And I suspect Patty's dry areas may not be as dry as mine. I have mostly sandy soils so by August after 3 or more months without any rain and only fog for precipitation the soil where they are planted has to be bone dry. I think I need to add this to most rainlilies that I can't get to bloom either. I forgot to mention in my earlier post that the Amaryllis belladonna and hybrids have been really nice this year and I know that not everyone can grow them. If Rob in Tasmania can get Rhodophiala bifida to bloom it will be more moisture in summer they need since he gets year round rainfall, but has moderate temperatures too. I got to see some Rhodophialas blooming this spring in Diana Chapman's large green houses where the temperatures are quite warm during the day. Mary Sue From arlen.jose@verizon.net Fri Sep 7 12:05:30 2007 Message-Id: From: "arlen jose" Subject: Amaryllis Belladonna!!! Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 12:06:32 -0400 Hello All, Last year William (Bill) Welch of Bill the Bulb Baron of Carmel Valley, offered huge bulbs Amaryllis Belladonna which I planted in my garden. I figured "what the heck, I'll give them another shot. Prior to this, I tried to grow them from the Dutch Bulb offerings that are usually found in the garden centers and nurseries in my area...big disappointment. They generally offer small shriveled and in shock bulbs that just wither away and go off to bulb heaven within a couple of seasons. Well...this year I was soooo happy to see a small pink scape poking up out of the ground that I hobbled (due to a back injury) to the garden and almost squealed with happiness. Luckily I didn't or the neighbors would have called the cops or thought two cat were at it again in the garden. The scape is growing slowly but it is about a foot (about 30cm) tall and still growing. This is the first and hopefully not the last time this beautiful bulb flowers. Warm Regards, Fred Biasella Cambridge (Boston) MA USDA Zone 6B From janemcgary@earthlink.net Fri Sep 7 12:06:01 2007 Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.0.20070907090345.01700010@mail.earthlink.net> From: Jane McGary Subject: Rhodophiala bifida Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 09:10:00 -0700 I can't grow Rhodophiala bifida here in northwestern Oregon, either. The plants just dwindle away over several years, as so many plants from summer-damp, hot climates do. I agree with Mary Sue that cold nights are probably the culprit. A 35-degree F (about 24 degrees C) difference between daytime and nighttime temperatures in midsummer is common where I live. The drop is a function of low atmospheric humidity, proximity to the cold Pacific coastal waters, and elevation gradients. Amaryllis belladonna will grow here but not flower (it will flower in the city of Portland, where the heat island effect raises night temperatures), and Nerines are greenhouse subjects exclusively. However, I can grow Zephyranthes and Habranthus in pots and flower them pretty well in summer. So, southerners and easterners, enjoy your subtropical amaryllids, and we will enjoy our Mediterranean and Californian bulbs! Jane McGary Northwestern Oregon, USA From rarebulbs@suddenlink.net Fri Sep 7 12:48:15 2007 Message-Id: <000701c7f16e$0da481d0$d62b6f4b@DJ9SK221> From: "Diana Chapman" Subject: Rhodophiala bifida Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 09:42:17 -0700 Hi Mary Sue: My Rhodophialas have been spectacular this year in my greenhouses, and we have had an unusually warm summer. The temperatures in the greenhouses get up to 100F easily, but cool to about 55F at night during the summer. I don't water the Rhodophialas after the leaves dry off, so they are pretty dry. I remember reading somewhere that there is a bed of the red R. bifida at Kew that blooms well, but probably south facing and against a wall. It's probably not enough heat, Mary Sue. Speaking of heat, and off-topic, I have just installed Aluminet shade cloth in my greenhouses. Has anyone any experience with this material? It is a knitted aluminum coated shade fabric that is supposed to cut heat. Diana Telos Rare Bulbs www.telosrarebulbs.com From leo@possi.org Fri Sep 7 12:45:15 2007 Message-Id: <40236.209.180.132.162.1189183437.squirrel@www.possi.org> From: "Leo A. Martin" Subject: Xerophyta retinervis Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 09:43:57 -0700 (MST) Hello All, I thought this might be of general interest so I'm copying the list. > Hi Leo, > > I think this message is meant for you. It came to the PBS list from a > nonmember so was delivered to the administrators. > > Mary Sue > > Hi Leo, > > I recently chanced upon some messages you posted in 2004 on the Pacific > Bulb Society forum when I was searching the internet for any info. on > Xerophyta retinervis germination/cultivation. You later on (in 2005) > posted a very interesting follow-up to your own initial enquiries on these > unusual plants about how you successfully germinated these plants. > > Cultural information on this species is pretty sporadic if non-existant so > you're probably a bit of a pioneer with trialing them. I was just > wondering, now 2 years on from you germinating them, how you got on with > growing them, if you were successful? How fast they grow & any cultural > hints i.e. soil, watering preference etc. > > Rachael Saunders from Silverhill Seeds (where I've recently purchased some > seeds from) indicates that they're difficult to grow. > > I'm used to growing Grasstrees (which Black stick lilys look like mini > versions of), proteas & cacti. I would anticipate that since they > originate from similar growing habitats as proteas/xanthorrhoes ie. > poor, stoney soil that they would require similar cultivation > requirements. > > Did they prove to be a challenge?, any information would be > appreciated! > Marc de'Battista. Littlehampton, West Sussex in > the UK. Hello Marc, To refresh our memory-- I sowed X. r. seed on top of sand in a 6-ounce polystyrene coffee cup. I punched holes in the cup's bottom, and set it in a deep plastic container with the water level just below the sand surface. The sand surface was glistening wet. I covered the cup with a plastic baggie and set it in bright shade in my house under a skylight. They sprouted quickly. I kept the water level in the container high. The X. r. seedlings I sprouted grew to a few millimeters tall, then just stopped growing. The remained alive for over two years with almost no growth, and then I forgot to water them, and the seedlings all died. I haven't been to Africa yet, but I did see other species of Xerophyta in Madagascar. All the species I saw grew on rock massifs, which correspond to what I believe are called koppies in South Africa. On such rocks, weathering leads to cracks and ridges where onionskin flaking occurs. Organic matter like leaves, and dust, fill in the irregularities, forming mats about a centimeter thick. Mosses form on these mats, and various plants sprout in these organic mats, sending their roots quite some distance horizontally, but never more than a centimeter or two deep. The mats enlarge over time. In the summer rainy season, the mats are probably always moist to wet. In the winter (when I was in Madagascar) the mats are quite dry. Associated plants were Aloe species like A. conifera, vandaceous orchids, and a large, upright Cynanchum (a leafless stem succulent millkweed.) Nearby grew Drosera madagascariensis. In the more substantial soil pockets were palmst of genus Dypsis. I don't know what I should have done next with my Xerophyta retinervis. But perhaps more sun would be in order; these mats also frequently have lots of bacteria, so perhaps they want plenty of fertilizer in cultivation. In any event, I still have seed, so I'm going to try again. Leo Martin Phoenix Arizona USA From rarebulbs@suddenlink.net Fri Sep 7 12:55:58 2007 Message-Id: <000b01c7f16f$21875690$d62b6f4b@DJ9SK221> From: "Diana Chapman" Subject: Amaryllis belladonna Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 09:50:00 -0700 Dear All: Has anyone ever heard of a miniature A. belladonna? I have a pot full of bulbs that are exactly like A. belladonna but are much smaller, the scapes being about 8" tall and flowers proprotionately smaller. I suppose it could be a hybrid, and I don't know where this pot of bulbs came from. Diana Telos Rare Bulbs www.telosrarebulbs.com From leo@possi.org Fri Sep 7 12:56:43 2007 Message-Id: <40707.209.180.132.162.1189184127.squirrel@www.possi.org> From: "Leo A. Martin" Subject: Rhodophiala bifida Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 09:55:27 -0700 (MST) > From: Mary Sue Ittner > Hi, > > Patty and I traded some bulbs. She sent me some of her Rhodophiala that > are so happy in Central Texas and they are not happy in coastal northern > California. I don't even know if they are still here. If Bob Werra can > bloom them and I can't, it could be heat in summer they need. I don't know > if it cools off at night in Ukiah where Bob lives as much as it does here, > but it is definitely hotter during the day. > ... > rainlilies that I can't get to bloom either. > ... > Amaryllis belladonna Rh. b. returns, blooms and increases year after year for me in a bed of mostly clay soil receiving regular summer watering. Rain lilies do very well here just about anywhere. The flowers last longer in afternoon shade. Amaryllis belladonna grows and increases well, but bloom is rare. It gets very hot here in Phoenix, probably hotter than most of your climates. I remember hiking in the N California coastal area when I was in school in San Francisco. When it was really warm the slugs came out. Leo Martin Phoenix Arizona USA From leo@possi.org Fri Sep 7 13:13:09 2007 Message-Id: <41792.209.180.132.162.1189185114.squirrel@www.possi.org> From: "Leo A. Martin" Subject: pill bugs Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 10:11:54 -0700 (MST) > I have a major infestation of the critters, which are more closely related > to shrimp than to the usual garden pests. Hmmm.... How do they taste? Maybe they'd be a good cash crop. Leo Martin Phoenix Arizona USA From jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Fri Sep 7 13:24:01 2007 Message-Id: <000b01c7f174$07d30a00$2f01a8c0@Library> From: "Jim McKenney" Subject: pill bugs Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 13:25:03 -0400 Great idea, Leo! Maybe they could be marketed as "garden krill" or "armadillo shrimp". Jim McKenney From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Fri Sep 7 13:41:41 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Rhodophiala bifida in KC Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 12:41:36 -0500 Dear all, I thought I'd refrain from any comments on this topic, but sometime bulbs bloom. I have two plantings of this species-both from 'northern', 'hardy' collections. One has been in a pot in the greenhouse since 2005. I was surprised to see it in both nearly full leaf and the first flower opening. This after a VERY hot dry summer. I brought the pot up to the deck near the hummingbird feeder, hoping it might distract the gang of hummers that fight over the feeder. There's seating for six, but any one will keep all the others away. Do hummers visit Rhodophialia? My second plant from Joe Shaw (Thanks Joe) went into a raised bed outdoors. Foliage came up this spring looking healthy, but was frozen in peak growth by late April freezes. So far no sign of new growth of flowers or leaves although subject to even more extremes of heat and dry outside. Might they still appear? Especially after a decent rain? The first bloom caused me to check out the Rhodophialia wiki page and I read that flowers appear before foliage, but pictures seem to hint tat some foliage was present. So Is the foliage synchronous with the flower stalks? And Fred good to hear of survival in Boston in the ground. Gives me some hope. Best Jim W. -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From rpries@sbcglobal.net Fri Sep 7 14:02:39 2007 Message-Id: <297134.25095.qm@web81915.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: Robt R Pries Subject: Rhodophiala bifida seed Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 11:02:39 -0700 (PDT) It maybe wishful thinking but I have a Rhodolphiala in bloom and I hope it will produce seed. Has anyone tried floating Rhodolphiala seeds on water to get germination? I have had good luck with Zephyranthes and Sprekelia seed treated this way but I expect to have only a few seeds if any and want to do the best for them. From rarebulbs@suddenlink.net Fri Sep 7 14:28:47 2007 Message-Id: <001701c7f17c$190a90b0$d62b6f4b@DJ9SK221> From: "Diana Chapman" Subject: Rhodophiala bifida seed Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 11:22:49 -0700 I don't float my Amaryllid seed any more, since I found it too labor intensive to transplant the seedlings. Now I put them in damp vermiculite in a plastic bag kept at room temperature, and get very good even germination. I then just dump the entire contents of the bag on top of the potting medium as soon as the radical starts to emerge. The seedlings that I floated also used to suffer to some degree from transplanting shock, which is not a problem germinating them in vermiculite. Diana Telos Rare Bulbs www.telosrarebulbs.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robt R Pries" To: "Pacific Bulb Society" Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 11:02 AM Subject: Re: [pbs] Rhodophiala bifida seed > > It maybe wishful thinking but I have a Rhodolphiala in > bloom and I hope it will produce seed. Has anyone > tried floating Rhodolphiala seeds on water to get > germination? I have had good luck with Zephyranthes > and Sprekelia seed treated this way but I expect to > have only a few seeds if any and want to do the best > for them. > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From toadlily@olywa.net Fri Sep 7 15:01:43 2007 Message-Id: <46E1A01B.8060100@olywa.net> From: Laura & Dave Subject: Rhodophiala bifida seed Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 12:01:47 -0700 Robt R Pries wrote: > Has anyone tried floating Rhodolphiala seeds on water to get > germination? Yes, just recently. using seed of Rhodophiala granatiflora from the PBS sent in by Alberto Castillo. There were about 60 seeds, which I received on the 3rd of May. I wasn't ready to plant them, so set them aside for a few days. Two months later, I discovered the package where I had buried it on the shelf; the seed looked quite a bit more dried out than when it arrived. Not being one to give up on plants, I floated about half the seed in a couple of centimeters of water in a hand sized container, set in a window sill that gets about 4 hours of direct sun (evaporation keeps the water from getting too hot). Four days later, there was an emerging radical on almost every seed. At the end of ten days, there were 3 cm long roots and 2 to 4 cm seed leaves from almost all the seed. I've experimented a bit, with these and other seeds, and find that moving the plants to soil before the seed leaf is less than one cm retards, or sometimes aborts, seed growth. When I planted the germinated seed, I tried to have the soil level at about the "crown" of the seedling; that is, where the seed leaf emerges from the radical. This leaves the remaining seed and the oldest part of the radical above or resting on the soil. One minor problem with this technique is that sometimes it's hard to get all the pieces pointing where you want them, since the roots tend to grow horizontally and the seed leaves grow up, at a ninety degree angle. I use a knife to cut a trench in the soil, place the seed, pile soil back in the trench and then move the soil around the roots with a very thin stream of water. I floated the rest of the seed two weeks after the first batch, with the same results . I now have 49 small plants enjoying the shade outside (should be fifty, but I dropped and broke one). I suspect that if all goes well, I'll be donating some small bulbs back to the PBS next year. Thanks for the great seed, Alberto! Hope this is helpful! Dave From robertwerra@pacific.net Fri Sep 7 15:06:59 2007 Message-Id: <001f01c7f182$8b50cf80$ba296ad0@popbob> From: robertwerra@pacific.net Subject: ?Rhodophiala bifida Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 12:08:58 -0700 To all, Rightly or wrongly, I water my pot of Rhodophiala all year long. Bob Werra From prallen2@peoplepc.com Fri Sep 7 18:51:05 2007 Message-Id: <13350095.1189205465284.JavaMail.root@mswamui-cedar.atl.sa.earthlink.net> From: patty allen Subject: Rhodophiala bifida seed Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 18:51:04 -0400 (EDT) I have never used the floatation method on either the reds nor pink oxbloods. After I get a goodly amount harvested and cured out for 4-5 days, I use regular potting soil and sprinkle the little seeds over on top of the soil. I then add about 1"-1 /12" soil over the seeds, tamp down firmly and water in with a fine mist until the soil is good and saturated.Place in bright shade and and keep moist. Before long you will have a sea of little green shoots coming up. I have a very good rate of germination with this method. Patty -----Original Message----- >From: Diana Chapman >Sent: Sep 7, 2007 2:22 PM >To: Pacific Bulb Society >Subject: Re: [pbs] Rhodophiala bifida seed > >I don't float my Amaryllid seed any more, since I found it too labor >intensive to transplant the seedlings. Now I put them in damp vermiculite >in a plastic bag kept at room temperature, and get very good even >germination. I then just dump the entire contents of the bag on top of the >potting medium as soon as the radical starts to emerge. The seedlings that >I floated also used to suffer to some degree from transplanting shock, which >is not a problem germinating them in vermiculite. > >Diana >Telos Rare Bulbs >www.telosrarebulbs.com >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Robt R Pries" >To: "Pacific Bulb Society" >Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 11:02 AM >Subject: Re: [pbs] Rhodophiala bifida seed > > >> >> It maybe wishful thinking but I have a Rhodolphiala in >> bloom and I hope it will produce seed. Has anyone >> tried floating Rhodolphiala seeds on water to get >> germination? I have had good luck with Zephyranthes >> and Sprekelia seed treated this way but I expect to >> have only a few seeds if any and want to do the best >> for them. >> _______________________________________________ >> pbs mailing list >> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > >_______________________________________________ >pbs mailing list >pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki ________________________________________ PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com From wpoulsen@pacbell.net Fri Sep 7 19:03:40 2007 Message-Id: <3cb90eee1bbe4afe66edfb5bd51ef129@pacbell.net> From: Lee Poulsen Subject: ?Rhodophiala bifida Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 16:03:38 -0700 I don't know what the year round climate is in Argentina where they are native to. But I grew up about 5 miles away from the wild fields where Scott Ogden, author of Garden Bulbs for the South and who now lives in the same area as well, says that the triploid version first appeared from bulbs imported from Argentina and abandoned back in the 1800s. I wish I knew the specific area where this is because it would be quite the sight to see them all in full bloom. Also, the city of Austin, Texas has almost but not quite overtaken that whole area with developments. Anyway, Austin gets about 32 inches of rain per year mostly spread out throughout the year. There is a peak in May and another peak in October, but no month averages less than about 2 inches. In practice however, there can be a month or two or more with no rain followed by periods of lots of rain, randomly through the year. It's relentlessly hot (mid-90s F.) and fairly humid (50-70%) all summer long. Winters are very similar to those in California, except for the occasional arctic blast that can drop the nighttime temperatures into the teens Fahrenheit for a night or three. This can happen once a winter or so. (Which is why oranges and avocados can't be grown all over Texas like they can in California. Unless you can find those obscure extremely cold-resistant varieties...). So I don't think Robert is wrong in watering his pot all year long, even when dormant. --Lee Poulsen Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a On Sep 7, 2007, at 12:08 PM, robertwerra@pacific.net wrote: > To all, Rightly or wrongly, I water my pot of Rhodophiala all year > long. Bob Werra From rvanderhoff@sbcglobal.net Fri Sep 7 23:24:55 2007 Message-Id: <967025.71740.qm@web81008.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: Ron Vanderhoff Subject: Ipheion 'Jessie' Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 20:24:54 -0700 (PDT) All of the Ipheion's do well in southern California - almost too well. I have grown 'Jessie' for two years in a container and it has multiplied from nine bulbs to 130 in that time. In my opinion it has better foliage that is a bit broader than the other "blue" selections like 'Rolf Fiedler', 'Wisley Blue' and 'Froyle Mill'. It is closest to 'Rolf Fiedler', but with a deeper blue flower, although the petals do not overlap as much. Highly recommended. Ron Vanderhoff Southern California Tony Avent wrote: Jim: Ipheion 'Jessie' has been out for year here in the garden and came through the winter fine. Tony Avent Plant Delights Nursery @ Juniper Level Botanic Garden 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F USDA Hardiness Zone 7b email tony@plantdelights.com website http://www.plantdelights.com phone 919 772-4794 fax 919 772-4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least three times" - Avent Jane McGary wrote: > Jim Waddick asked about this new cultivar. > > One bulb given me by Wim de Goede 3 years ago increased very well, and I > offered it as a "bonus" on orders this year. I cannot sell it because it is > under Grower's Rights in the Netherlands. > > 'Jessie' is indeed a remarkable color, a real gentian blue, very like the > color of Commelina dianthifolia. It is a small plant, about half the size > of the Ipheion uniflorum cultivars more widely grown. It was selected by > Tony Hall of Kew and named for his late sister, Jessie. > > I don't know how cold-hardy this plant is, since I grow it in an unheated > frame where the temperature never goes below about 20 degrees F. However, > it is really pretty. > > Jane McGary > Northwestern Oregon, USA > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From dells@voicenet.com Sat Sep 8 08:16:07 2007 Message-Id: <20070908121602.AB0764C014@lists.ibiblio.org> From: "Dell Sherk" Subject: BOD Meeting Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 08:15:37 -0400 Are we still going to have a BOD meeting tomorrow? If so, I will have to limit the amount of time I can give; I have a million other things to do. If we do meet, I hope we will find out what is the hold up on the newsletter, especially, and I propose that we start thinking about sending out renewal notices before the end of 2007 rather than waiting till we have a big list of people who haven't got around to renewing. Rather than submit a BX report, I will work on getting BX 152 packed up. It offers 51 items and has about thirty participants. Cheers, Dell From dejager@bulbargence.com Sat Sep 8 08:56:15 2007 Message-Id: From: Bulbargence Subject: Rhodophyela bifida & Lycoris radiata planting depth Date: Sat, 08 Sep 2007 14:56:07 +0200 Bonjour, Rhodophiala bifida and Lycoris radiata (and chinense) are both in flower here in the ground When lifiçtng bulbs to sellI have some interesting observations about the planting depth. When planted Rhodophiala shallow 50-100mm (2-4") it always pulls itself down to 150-200mm (6-8") to reach cool and humid layers. Lycoris radiata, I just find out, does exactly the contrary: they were planted at 75-100mm (3-4") and now whenpulling them up all have formed a secondary bulb at the level of 30-50mm (1-2") One never stops learning! Lauw de Jager http://www.bulbargence.com South of France (zone 8 Olivier) Coord. Geogr.(GPS): 43°42' 43" N 4° 32' 12" E Jim Shields: > Rhodophiala bifida must need fairly extreme conditions to bloom. They > probably need hot summers and cold winters, neither of which Mary Sue has > at her current home. > > We have some Lycoris radiata radiata here too, that survive and sometimes > bloom, but definitely do not thrive outdoors in the ground. The diploid > form of L. radiata does not survive here. From hornig@usadatanet.net Sat Sep 8 11:01:41 2007 Message-Id: <2FCD5967BB7C4A6CB6729F7F907B10D5@ellenPC> From: "Ellen Hornig" Subject: Unspotted red Tigridia pavonia Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 11:01:27 -0400 Mary Sue Ittner has very kindly added a photo of mine to the wiki: a picture of a lovely unspotted red Tigridia pavonia, a seedling of my own 'Sunset in Oz', that opened the other day (see http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki/index.php/Tigridia > I don't know how often these unspotted forms come up - this parent has produced a couple of others, similar to the second in line on the wiki page (described as "tangerine") - but they're kind of neat. Just thought some other people might enjoy seeing it. Ellen Ellen Hornig Seneca Hill Perennials 3712 County Route 57 Oswego NY 13126 USA www.senecahillperennials.com From carlobal@netzero.net Sat Sep 8 13:20:39 2007 Message-Id: <20070908.131804.4491.0@webmail13.vgs.untd.com> From: "carlobal@netzero.net" Subject: Unspotted red Tigridia pavonia Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 17:18:04 GMT Wow! Quite a stunner Ellen! Carlo A. Balistrieri The Gardens at Turtle Point Tuxedo Park, NY 10987 Zone 6 (845.351.2049) Visit: www.botanicalgardening.com From africanbulbs@haznet.co.za Sat Sep 8 13:44:19 2007 Message-Id: <000201c7f23f$eab09150$973cd0c4@mcmasterdae8d5> From: "Rhoda and Cameron McMaster" Subject: IBSA Excursion Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 19:44:13 +0200 Its spring in the Western Cape and our Indigenous Bulb Grower's Association (IBSA) has been arranging a number of excursions to view the flowers. Today it was my turn to host them on a visit to the farm Fairfield near the town of Napier where I live. This farm has been well preserved and has elements of both sandstone (Fynbos) and shale derived soils (Renosterveld), so there is a wide variety of bulbs and other species. Today the weather was fine and there was a lot in flower. The list below of what we saw is just a snapshot of the flolwers today - a week ago there were other species out and in the weeks ahead there will be many more species flowering. Moraea elegans occurs only on this farm and M melonops is confined to this region and is quite rare - but very common on Fairfield. The Gladiolus rudis was a magnificent sight to see. We wish you could join us on these excursions. Fairfield check list 08-Sep-07 Aristea africana Aristea spiralis Aristea teretifolia Geissorhiza inflexa Geissorhiza ovata Gladiolus bullatus Gladiolus debilis Gladiolus gracilis Gladiolus hirsutus Gladiolus liliaceus Gladiolus rudis Ixia - another two species Ixia stricta Moraea angusta Moraea elegans Moraea fergusoniae Moraea fugacissima Moraea gawleri Moraea melonops Moraea melonops x fugacissima hybrid Moraea papilionacea Romulea dichotama Romulea flava Romulea hirta var cooperi Romulea rosea Sparaxis grandiflora Eucomis regia Lachenalia lutea Spiloxene capensis Wurmbea minima Orchids Bartholina burmanniana Disperis villosa Pterygodium caffrum Pterygodium catholicum Satyrium species Cameron McMaster African Bulbs PO Box 26, Napier 7270 Tel/Fax: 028 423 3651 Mobile: 082 774 2075 Email: africanbulbs@haznet.co.za Website: www.africanbulbs.com From jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Sat Sep 8 14:39:51 2007 Message-Id: <000301c7f247$c9f365c0$2f01a8c0@Library> From: "Jim McKenney" Subject: Unspotted red Tigridia pavonia Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 14:40:53 -0400 Ellen Hornig wrote "I don't know how often these unspotted forms come up." Let's hope it's a lot more often, Ellen, that one is really beautiful. I don't know how often they come up now, but in the past there was something called the "Immaculata" strain of Tigridia pavonia which had flowers characterized by a lack of spotting. Again, in the past, separate colors were offered. Somewhere among the accumulated ephemera here I have the catalog/folder of an outfit which once grew Tigridia pavonia in the Pacific Northwest back in the 1940s or so - maybe Wilson Brothers or something like that. As I recall, they had fifteen or twenty different named strains or clones of Tigridia in various color combinations. Jim McKenney jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Montgomery County, Maryland, USA, USDA zone 7 where all this talk about Rhodophiala is making me antsy: there is no sign of bloom here yet. My Virtual Maryland Garden http://www.jimmckenney.com BLOG! http://mcwort.blogspot.com/ where you can see "the glorie of all these kindes": tale a look. Webmaster Potomac Valley Chapter, NARGS Editor PVC Bulletin http://www.pvcnargs.org Webmaster Potomac Lily Society http://www.potomaclilysociety.org From rpries@sbcglobal.net Sat Sep 8 19:21:25 2007 Message-Id: <187734.55031.qm@web81901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: Robt R Pries Subject: Rhodophyela bifida & Lycoris radiata planting depth Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 16:21:25 -0700 (PDT) Lauw; I am glad you made this observation because I had noticed some of the same behavior. On some Lycoris I noticed "stalks" with a bulb at the base and another formed above the lower bulb. I was having some trouble deciding whether the newest bulb was the upper or the lower and whether the plant was trying to get shallower or go deeper. i have been trying to hybridize Lycoris and dug everything from 1 year seedlings, 2year etc. to my six year seedlings this spring becaase I am moving the garden. In looking at the age progression in the seedlings it seemed to me that they were going deeper and deeper the older they were. I have been reading about Lycoris this spring and all me references were saying they bloom better when they are planted shallowly. I was a bit confused becuase the plants seemd to be telling me that they like depth. The books I was using were zone 7-10 garden writers and my present garden is zone 5/6. Could it be that in colder zones the plant pull themselves lower than in warmer climates. Since I am moving to a zone 7 I shall plant less deep in the new garden but I am still confused by the action of the plants. I hope next year to see the first blooms on my oldest crosses. --- Bulbargence wrote: > Bonjour, > Rhodophiala bifida and Lycoris radiata (and > chinense) are both in flower > here in the ground When lifiçtng bulbs to sellI have > some interesting > observations about the planting depth. When planted > Rhodophiala shallow > 50-100mm (2-4") it always pulls itself down to > 150-200mm (6-8") to reach > cool and humid layers. Lycoris radiata, I just find > out, does exactly the > contrary: they were planted at 75-100mm (3-4") and > now whenpulling them up > all have formed a secondary bulb at the level of > 30-50mm (1-2") > One never stops learning! > > Lauw de Jager > http://www.bulbargence.com > South of France (zone 8 Olivier) > Coord. Geogr.(GPS): 43°42' 43" N 4° 32' 12" E > > > > Jim Shields: > > Rhodophiala bifida must need fairly extreme > conditions to bloom. They > > probably need hot summers and cold winters, > neither of which Mary Sue has > > at her current home. > > > > We have some Lycoris radiata radiata here too, > that survive and sometimes > > bloom, but definitely do not thrive outdoors in > the ground. The diploid > > form of L. radiata does not survive here. > > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From rpries@sbcglobal.net Sat Sep 8 19:31:38 2007 Message-Id: <359062.58669.qm@web81901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: Robt R Pries Subject: Rhodophyela bifida Myths? Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 16:31:38 -0700 (PDT) I f people have been following the Rhodolphiala discussion they may have noted some inconsistencies. As I hinted in my first post the literature tells us there is an oxblood lily that is most common across the South that multiplies by offsets but rarely produced seed. This red hurricane lily is said to be triploid and from a single introduction by Oberwetter. But note several posts have noyed that they get seed on their red Rhodolphialas when they have other clones such as the pink form in their gardens. I am not sure of when this particular clone was declared triploid but there is another explanation that may better fit the facts. Perhaps Rhodolphiala is self sterile and an obligate outcrosser. If all the Southern Reds were clones of a single original plant than perhaps there is no seed produced beause it requires a second clone to fertilize it. This would seem a better explanation of fact that the triploid theory that has been widely published. --- Robt R Pries wrote: > Lauw; I am glad you made this observation because I > had noticed some of the same behavior. On some > Lycoris > I noticed "stalks" with a bulb at the base and > another > formed above the lower bulb. I was having some > trouble > deciding whether the newest bulb was the upper or > the > lower and whether the plant was trying to get > shallower or go deeper. i have been trying to > hybridize Lycoris and dug everything from 1 year > seedlings, 2year etc. to my six year seedlings this > spring becaase I am moving the garden. In looking at > the age progression in the seedlings it seemed to me > that they were going deeper and deeper the older > they > were. I have been reading about Lycoris this spring > and all me references were saying they bloom better > when they are planted shallowly. I was a bit > confused > becuase the plants seemd to be telling me that they > like depth. The books I was using were zone 7-10 > garden writers and my present garden is zone 5/6. > Could it be that in colder zones the plant pull > themselves lower than in warmer climates. Since I am > moving to a zone 7 I shall plant less deep in the > new > garden but I am still confused by the action of the > plants. I hope next year to see the first blooms on > my > oldest crosses. > > --- Bulbargence wrote: > > > Bonjour, > > Rhodophiala bifida and Lycoris radiata (and > > chinense) are both in flower > > here in the ground When lifiçtng bulbs to sellI > have > > some interesting > > observations about the planting depth. When > planted > > Rhodophiala shallow > > 50-100mm (2-4") it always pulls itself down to > > 150-200mm (6-8") to reach > > cool and humid layers. Lycoris radiata, I just > find > > out, does exactly the > > contrary: they were planted at 75-100mm (3-4") > and > > now whenpulling them up > > all have formed a secondary bulb at the level of > > 30-50mm (1-2") > > One never stops learning! > > > > Lauw de Jager > > http://www.bulbargence.com > > South of France (zone 8 Olivier) > > Coord. Geogr.(GPS): 43°42' 43" N 4° 32' 12" E > > > > > > > > Jim Shields: > > > Rhodophiala bifida must need fairly extreme > > conditions to bloom. They > > > probably need hot summers and cold winters, > > neither of which Mary Sue has > > > at her current home. > > > > > > We have some Lycoris radiata radiata here too, > > that survive and sometimes > > > bloom, but definitely do not thrive outdoors in > > the ground. The diploid > > > form of L. radiata does not survive here. > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > pbs mailing list > > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Sat Sep 8 20:12:55 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Lycoris radiata planting depth Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 18:41:37 -0500 Dear LAuw and all. A few years ago I saw L. radiata and another species growing in the wild in Hunan Province. This is a Zone 7 or 8 equivalent climate. They were growing in very damp soil along a stream and the bulbs were 80 to 90 percent exposed. The roots were not visible, but by tipping the flowering stem ( it was August) the roots were easily disturbed. In colder climates like mine, L. radiata is quite deep - maybe 6 inches to the base of the bulbs. Just a few observations. Jim W, -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From prallen2@peoplepc.com Sat Sep 8 19:55:38 2007 Message-Id: <14054860.1189295736110.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net> From: patty allen Subject: Rhodophyela bifida Myths? Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 19:55:35 -0400 (EDT) Robert, In my post I failed to explain that the heirloom red oxbloods I have been growing for so many years started setting seeds several years before I had any pink oxbloods in my garden. All my reds came from the same general area in Central Texas. I should have some bulbs blooming from that first crop of seeds in about another year or two. Patty -----Original Message----- >From: Robt R Pries >Sent: Sep 8, 2007 7:31 PM >To: Pacific Bulb Society >Subject: [pbs] Rhodophyela bifida Myths? > >I f people have been following the Rhodolphiala >discussion they may have noted some inconsistencies. >As I hinted in my first post the literature tells us >there is an oxblood lily that is most common across >the South that multiplies by offsets but rarely >produced seed. This red hurricane lily is said to be >triploid and from a single introduction by Oberwetter. >But note several posts have noyed that they get seed >on their red Rhodolphialas when they have other clones >such as the pink form in their gardens. I am not sure >of when this particular clone was declared triploid >but there is another explanation that may better fit >the facts. Perhaps Rhodolphiala is self sterile and an >obligate outcrosser. If all the Southern Reds were >clones of a single original plant than perhaps there >is no seed produced beause it requires a second clone >to fertilize it. This would seem a better explanation >of fact that the triploid theory that has been widely >published. >--- Robt R Pries wrote: > >> Lauw; I am glad you made this observation because I >> had noticed some of the same behavior. On some >> Lycoris >> I noticed "stalks" with a bulb at the base and >> another >> formed above the lower bulb. I was having some >> trouble >> deciding whether the newest bulb was the upper or >> the >> lower and whether the plant was trying to get >> shallower or go deeper. i have been trying to >> hybridize Lycoris and dug everything from 1 year >> seedlings, 2year etc. to my six year seedlings this >> spring becaase I am moving the garden. In looking at >> the age progression in the seedlings it seemed to me >> that they were going deeper and deeper the older >> they >> were. I have been reading about Lycoris this spring >> and all me references were saying they bloom better >> when they are planted shallowly. I was a bit >> confused >> becuase the plants seemd to be telling me that they >> like depth. The books I was using were zone 7-10 >> garden writers and my present garden is zone 5/6. >> Could it be that in colder zones the plant pull >> themselves lower than in warmer climates. Since I am >> moving to a zone 7 I shall plant less deep in the >> new >> garden but I am still confused by the action of the >> plants. I hope next year to see the first blooms on >> my >> oldest crosses. >> >> --- Bulbargence wrote: >> >> > Bonjour, >> > Rhodophiala bifida and Lycoris radiata (and >> > chinense) are both in flower >> > here in the ground When lifiçtng bulbs to sellI >> have >> > some interesting >> > observations about the planting depth. When >> planted >> > Rhodophiala shallow >> > 50-100mm (2-4") it always pulls itself down to >> > 150-200mm (6-8") to reach >> > cool and humid layers. Lycoris radiata, I just >> find >> > out, does exactly the >> > contrary: they were planted at 75-100mm (3-4") >> and >> > now whenpulling them up >> > all have formed a secondary bulb at the level of >> > 30-50mm (1-2") >> > One never stops learning! >> > >> > Lauw de Jager >> > http://www.bulbargence.com >> > South of France (zone 8 Olivier) >> > Coord. Geogr.(GPS): 43°42' 43" N 4° 32' 12" E >> > >> > >> > >> > Jim Shields: >> > > Rhodophiala bifida must need fairly extreme >> > conditions to bloom. They >> > > probably need hot summers and cold winters, >> > neither of which Mary Sue has >> > > at her current home. >> > > >> > > We have some Lycoris radiata radiata here too, >> > that survive and sometimes >> > > bloom, but definitely do not thrive outdoors in >> > the ground. The diploid >> > > form of L. radiata does not survive here. >> > >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > pbs mailing list >> > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >> > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >> > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> pbs mailing list >> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki >> > >_______________________________________________ >pbs mailing list >pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki ________________________________________ PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com From aroidgrower@verizon.net Sat Sep 8 20:18:12 2007 Message-Id: From: John Ludwig Subject: Worsleya Plant or seed availability Date: Sat, 08 Sep 2007 20:18:11 -0400 I have been searching for Worsleya plants or seeds available in the US. Does anybody know of any US growers? From rpries@sbcglobal.net Sat Sep 8 21:16:10 2007 Message-Id: <734685.88021.qm@web81903.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: Robt R Pries Subject: Rhodophyela bifida Myths? Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 18:16:08 -0700 (PDT) Patty; Obviously the idea that the red heirloom oxbloods never set seed is a myth. But perhaps something has changed. Reports of cultivated plants suddenly becoming fertile are not uncommon. Presumably the unbalanced chromosome counts suddenly become balanced through some serendipitous cell division that looses the unwanted chromosomes. Since Tony also reported a sudden increase in fertility with new genes in his population it there may be more than one thing happening here. It would be interested to see if some plants reamained infertile while others have become consistently fertile. It would also be of interest to note whether higher seed sets occurred between different clones than similar clones. Even before we know these things we can already conclude the the hierloom oxbloods are no longer totally sterile as the books say. --- patty allen wrote: > Robert, > In my post I failed to explain that the heirloom red > oxbloods I have been growing for so many years > started setting seeds several years before I had any > pink oxbloods in my garden. All my reds came from > the same general area in Central Texas. I should > have some bulbs blooming from that first crop of > seeds in about another year or two. > Patty > > -----Original Message----- > >From: Robt R Pries > >Sent: Sep 8, 2007 7:31 PM > >To: Pacific Bulb Society > >Subject: [pbs] Rhodophyela bifida Myths? > > > >I f people have been following the Rhodolphiala > >discussion they may have noted some > inconsistencies. > >As I hinted in my first post the literature tells > us > >there is an oxblood lily that is most common across > >the South that multiplies by offsets but rarely > >produced seed. This red hurricane lily is said to > be > >triploid and from a single introduction by > Oberwetter. > >But note several posts have noyed that they get > seed > >on their red Rhodolphialas when they have other > clones > >such as the pink form in their gardens. I am not > sure > >of when this particular clone was declared triploid > >but there is another explanation that may better > fit > >the facts. Perhaps Rhodolphiala is self sterile and > an > >obligate outcrosser. If all the Southern Reds were > >clones of a single original plant than perhaps > there > >is no seed produced beause it requires a second > clone > >to fertilize it. This would seem a better > explanation > >of fact that the triploid theory that has been > widely > >published. > >--- Robt R Pries wrote: > > > >> Lauw; I am glad you made this observation because > I > >> had noticed some of the same behavior. On some > >> Lycoris > >> I noticed "stalks" with a bulb at the base and > >> another > >> formed above the lower bulb. I was having some > >> trouble > >> deciding whether the newest bulb was the upper or > >> the > >> lower and whether the plant was trying to get > >> shallower or go deeper. i have been trying to > >> hybridize Lycoris and dug everything from 1 year > >> seedlings, 2year etc. to my six year seedlings > this > >> spring becaase I am moving the garden. In looking > at > >> the age progression in the seedlings it seemed to > me > >> that they were going deeper and deeper the older > >> they > >> were. I have been reading about Lycoris this > spring > >> and all me references were saying they bloom > better > >> when they are planted shallowly. I was a bit > >> confused > >> becuase the plants seemd to be telling me that > they > >> like depth. The books I was using were zone 7-10 > >> garden writers and my present garden is zone 5/6. > >> Could it be that in colder zones the plant pull > >> themselves lower than in warmer climates. Since I > am > >> moving to a zone 7 I shall plant less deep in the > >> new > >> garden but I am still confused by the action of > the > >> plants. I hope next year to see the first blooms > on > >> my > >> oldest crosses. > >> > >> --- Bulbargence wrote: > >> > >> > Bonjour, > >> > Rhodophiala bifida and Lycoris radiata (and > >> > chinense) are both in flower > >> > here in the ground When lifiçtng bulbs to sellI > >> have > >> > some interesting > >> > observations about the planting depth. When > >> planted > >> > Rhodophiala shallow > >> > 50-100mm (2-4") it always pulls itself down to > >> > 150-200mm (6-8") to reach > >> > cool and humid layers. Lycoris radiata, I just > >> find > >> > out, does exactly the > >> > contrary: they were planted at 75-100mm (3-4") > >> and > >> > now whenpulling them up > >> > all have formed a secondary bulb at the level > of > >> > 30-50mm (1-2") > >> > One never stops learning! > >> > > >> > Lauw de Jager > >> > http://www.bulbargence.com > >> > South of France (zone 8 Olivier) > >> > Coord. Geogr.(GPS): 43°42' 43" N 4° 32' 12" > E > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > Jim Shields: > >> > > Rhodophiala bifida must need fairly extreme > >> > conditions to bloom. They > >> > > probably need hot summers and cold winters, > >> > neither of which Mary Sue has > >> > > at her current home. > >> > > > >> > > We have some Lycoris radiata radiata here > too, > >> > that survive and sometimes > >> > > bloom, but definitely do not thrive outdoors > in > >> > the ground. The diploid > >> > > form of L. radiata does not survive here. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > pbs mailing list > >> > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > >> > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > >> > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > >> > > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> pbs mailing list > >> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > >> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > >> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > >> > > > >_______________________________________________ > >pbs mailing list > >pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > >http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > >http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > > ________________________________________ > PeoplePC Online > A better way to Internet > http://www.peoplepc.com > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From wpoulsen@pacbell.net Sun Sep 9 02:08:43 2007 Message-Id: From: Lee Poulsen Subject: Worsleya Plant or seed availability Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 23:08:39 -0700 On Sep 8, 2007, at 5:18 PM, John Ludwig wrote: > I have been searching for Worsleya plants or seeds available in the > US. Does anybody know of any US growers? You need to join the Worsleya group on Yahoo Groups. From time to time both Worsleya bulbs as well as Worsleya seeds are offered. Sometime during our winter, there will most likely be more bulbs and seeds offered out of Australia. There is a guy in the U.S. who just offered a large number of seeds a couple of months ago, but he doesn't have any right now. He may or may not be getting more in the future. There is another guy down in Florida who offers almost mature and mature bulbs (and they're very expensive) that he grows at his farm in the mountains down in Mexico (Bruce Pearson ). --Lee Poulsen Pasadena, California, USA, USDA Zone 10a From lewisia1@verizon.net Sun Sep 9 22:17:36 2007 Message-Id: <0JO4000GXRP4W8K1@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> From: Joyce Miller Subject: Rhodophiala bifida seed Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2007 19:17:19 -0700 Like Diana, my Amaryllid seed transplanted poorly after germinating in water. Now, I sow the seed in potting soil, cover it slightly with grit and set the pot in water until germination occurs. Voila, no transplanting shock. Joyce Miller, Gresham, Oregon USDA Zone 8. From dryle@wi-net.com Sun Sep 9 23:03:20 2007 Message-Id: <017401c7f357$1524b520$0201a8c0@VALUED7B9600FA> From: "David Ryle" Subject: International delays Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2007 22:02:53 -0500 Hello, With regards to delays don't feel singled out. I've been employed in the Dutch bulb export business for a number of years, and even with standard shipping procedures, being inspected prior to ship by both Dutch and U.S. officials, since 9/11 security at all international docks has been dramatically increased. The concerns regarding the possibility of biological weapons etc; everything is backlogged. Daffodils this year are being held up in Virginia, courtesy of Homeland security and their concerns. David From wpoulsen@pacbell.net Mon Sep 10 14:30:52 2007 Message-Id: From: Lee Poulsen Subject: Cryptostephanus haemanthoides available Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 11:30:50 -0700 For those interested, the online specialty nursery, Rare Exotics based in Los Angeles , currently has Cryptostephanus haemanthoides in stock. (See .) --Lee Poulsen Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a From j.grimshaw@virgin.net Tue Sep 11 01:40:00 2007 Message-Id: <002901c7f436$30d671c0$0201a8c0@John> From: "John Grimshaw" Subject: Cryptostephanus haemanthoides available Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2007 06:39:57 +0100 These must be wild-dug bulbs, as many of the plants offered seem to be. John Grimshaw Dr John M. Grimshaw Sycamore Cottage Colesbourne Nr Cheltenham Gloucestershire GL53 9NP Tel. 01242 870567 COLESBOURNE PARK OPEN DAYS 2007 Easter Monday 9 April, Arboretum Weekend 15-16 September Gates open 1pm, last entry 4 pm website: www.colesbournegardens.org.uk ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lee Poulsen" > For those interested, the online specialty nursery, Rare Exotics based > in Los Angeles , currently has > Cryptostephanus haemanthoides in stock. (See > .) > From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Tue Sep 11 15:42:40 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Cryptostephanus musing Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2007 12:56:55 -0500 Dear John, Lee and all, I have grown Cr. vansonii the commonest species for a few years and for all intents it looks and grows pretty much like a mini - Clivia with even mini-er flowers. Although I have only seen C. haemanthoides a few times, it seems to me a strikingly different plant in form from C. vansonii. Don't know the other C. species at all. How variable are all these? Any thoughts? Any of them hybridize either with each other or Clivia? Thanks Jim W -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From agoston.janos123@gmail.com Tue Sep 11 14:16:55 2007 Message-Id: <3b9284cd0709111116va53977cu435c4aff5849c102@mail.gmail.com> From: "Jan Agoston" Subject: International delays Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2007 20:16:54 +0200 Is it possible to keep the bulbs in a cooled cell? Or how do the customs/*phyto store them, cause here we have had some problems this spring with tropical rhizomatous plants, some of them died, and they were very expensive... You may reply privately if it is not soo public... Thank you for your attention! Jani 2007/9/10, David Ryle : > > Hello, > With regards to delays don't feel singled out. I've been employed in the > Dutch bulb export business for a number of years, and even with standard > shipping procedures, being inspected prior to ship by both Dutch and U.S. > officials, since 9/11 security at all international docks has been > dramatically increased. > The concerns regarding the possibility of biological weapons etc; > everything is backlogged. Daffodils this year are being held up in Virginia, > courtesy of Homeland security and their concerns. > > David > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Tue Sep 11 16:06:28 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: International delays Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:05:33 -0500 >Is it possible to keep the bulbs in a cooled cell? > > The concerns regarding the possibility of biological weapons etc; >> everything is backlogged. Daffodils this year are being held up in Virginia, > > courtesy of Homeland security and their concerns. Dear all, Unfortunately it is impossible to know how any plants are handled from shipper to your door. Most of the delays on import into the US are due to demands of Homeland Security, Border Patrol, USDA or Customs or all of them!. This usually means the plants stay at the shippers warehouse until the papers are cleared and the plants released for their next step. Some shippers recognize that plants are in transit and keep them cool or at least shaded, others may just pile boxes on the shipping dock in hot dry conditions. It is strictly up to the shipper of middle man. Once plants get to a government office they are usually processed quickly and moved to the next handler. I just got a large box from Asia with big gaping holes and barely held together. No one along the way seemed to have a working roll of duct tape! Only 13 items fell out. Oh well. Best Jim W. -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From dryle@wi-net.com Tue Sep 11 21:26:28 2007 Message-Id: <000601c7f4db$e0632e80$0201a8c0@VALUED7B9600FA> From: "David Ryle" Subject: International delays Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2007 20:25:58 -0500 Hello Jan, Rhizomztous plants in particular pose specific problems in long distance shipping. Most species seem not to fare very well. To give you an example: for three years a company I worked with tried to develop a storage technique that would allow us to hold rhizomes of various Iris germanica cultivars through the winter so that they could be marketed in spring here in the U.S. The results were nothing short of a complete failure. We eventually concluded that it was impossible, and now have the roots potted up in Oregon in late summer held in cold frames and shipped out in spring! Holding tropical plants rhizomatous or any other for that matter,in a cool state ie; refrigerated, is usually contrary to the plants normal physiolgical state and would probably begin to cause damage in a short space of time. How short a period would vary with species, would involve serious research, and involve more than a little conjecture. I'm sorry that I could not be of more assistance. regards David Ryle ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jan Agoston" To: "Pacific Bulb Society" Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 1:16 PM Subject: Re: [pbs] International delays > Is it possible to keep the bulbs in a cooled cell? Or how do the > customs/*phyto store them, cause here we have had some problems this > spring > with tropical rhizomatous plants, some of them died, and they were very > expensive... > > You may reply privately if it is not soo public... > > Thank you for your attention! > Jani > > 2007/9/10, David Ryle : >> >> Hello, >> With regards to delays don't feel singled out. I've been employed in the >> Dutch bulb export business for a number of years, and even with standard >> shipping procedures, being inspected prior to ship by both Dutch and U.S. >> officials, since 9/11 security at all international docks has been >> dramatically increased. >> The concerns regarding the possibility of biological weapons etc; >> everything is backlogged. Daffodils this year are being held up in >> Virginia, >> courtesy of Homeland security and their concerns. >> >> David >> >> _______________________________________________ >> pbs mailing list >> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki >> > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From agoston.janos123@gmail.com Wed Sep 12 07:19:49 2007 Message-Id: <3b9284cd0709120419p3f5d2054t635d7f90951efa80@mail.gmail.com> From: "Jan Agoston" Subject: International delays Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 13:19:47 +0200 Yes, I see these problems, and I can understand them. Here we have had problems with the customs, the Phytosanitary Inspector was very kind. The post was expensive. I mean we have payed a horrible amount just for shipping. Than in the office we have payed also for opening and closing the boxes. It means that a kind of material like duck tape were used to close them, but it was not that durable. The problem was that for this method we payed nearly the same amount as fot the phytosanitary inspection. Sorry if this is off topic, but I think it is interesting to know, that how difficult is to import plants, and how companies can get over these problems. Bye, Jani From aquaflorasa@telkomsa.net Wed Sep 12 13:34:46 2007 Message-Id: <004801c7f563$16703bd0$94b1ef9b@p7d1p2> From: "Aqua Flora" Subject: Cryptostephanus Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 19:16:10 +0200 Dear Jim W and all interested, To answer your questions, there are 3 species of Cryptostephanus, C. vansonii from Zimbabwe, C. haemanthoides from Tanzania and C. densiflorus from Angola, the later has also been reported to occur in Northern Namibia. For those of you who are not familiar with the genus, C. vansonii has white to pale pink flowers while the other two species has dark purple to black or brown flowers. C. vansonii is relatively easy of cultivation, while C .haemanthoides is reported to rather difficult. As far as I know C. densiflorus is not yet in cultivation, but likely to be just as difficult as C. haemanthoides. I have also grown C. vansonii for a number of years and it is by far the most common of the three species, though still quite rare. I have tried to pollinate it with Clivia and the reverse cross as well, with no success. Although I have heard rumours of this being done successfully , I have not yet seen the proof of the pudding! As for hybrids between the different Cryptostephanus species, the other two species are still so rare in cultivation that I doubt anyone has attempted this. I suspect that such hybrids would produce some very interesting results. I have no idea how variable C. haemanthoides or C. densiflorus are, but I know that there are certain forms of C. vansonii with much darker pink flowers than usual. Kind regards, Pieter van der Walt Hartbeespoort, South Africa. From adam14113@ameritech.net Wed Sep 12 15:00:42 2007 Message-Id: <001001c7f56e$f32f4ec0$5ad8fea9@FAMILY> From: "Adam Fikso" Subject: pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 14 Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 13:58:44 -0500 Considering the importance of the phytosanitary issue , and the likelihood of it continuing--why don't we start considering phytosanitary issues and delays as being "on-topic"?. Apparently there is a new set of standards being considered for international uniformity which derives its concerns not only from terrorist concerns, but from anxiety and concern about genetically engineered seeds and plants, which might be used as vehicles for terrorist goals. being issued by the Secretariat of the International Plant Proection Convention , Food and Agriculture Organizationn of the U.N.. Jacques Diouf, Director-General. For example, there is current research on transgenic corn which would carry a gene to protect against E.coli just as a result of eating it, and another line of research which would protect against HIV infection. (Chicago Tribune Magazine Section, September 9, 2007) . Most of you are probably already aware of the transgenic corn pollen which destroyed thousands of Monarch Butterflies. Given this, what is to keep a bio-terrorist from using similar methods to infect or destroy a population of people? Without answering the questions implied here, the issue of how one guards against this bio-terrorist eventuality by developing and writing regulations for the inspection and transport of seed between countries becomes an enormous task. Relevant questions for governments are: What kind of inspection is even possible? What kinds of quarantines are facing us in the future? I think that much of the present concern we're seeing is motivated in part by some of the above issues. So, growing decorative plants from seed from other places may become much more restrictive in the near future, and perhaps for a long time. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 11:00 AM Subject: pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 14 From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Wed Sep 12 15:02:00 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Cryptostephanus Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 13:59:29 -0500 Dear Pieter, Your note made me go back and re-read Harold Koopowitz' account of the genus in his excellent book 'Clivia' (Timber Press,2002). This book is a must for Clivia fans and sure to induce clivia-envy. He mentions that hybrids between Crypt. and Clivia have been tried, but no success reported. Apparently the '3rd' species C. densiflorus has never been in cultivation. Oddly both C. densiflorus and C. haemanthoides are deciduous unlike C. vansonii or Clivia sp. Harold also mentions Cyrtanthus herrei (seen at http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki/index.php/CyrtanthusSpeciesTwo#herrei) . This was originally described as a Cryptostephanus and looks remarkably like Clivia caulescens. ! I grow a 'so called' pink C. vansonii, but the color only shows up if the bloom is during a cool period. IN warmer weather the flowers are essentially white like the 'typical' form. Intriguong plants. Thanks for the info. Jim W. >To answer your questions, there are 3 species of Cryptostephanus, C. >vansonii from Zimbabwe, C. haemanthoides from Tanzania and C. densiflorus >from Angola, the later has also been reported to occur in Northern Namibia. ..... >As for hybrids between the different Cryptostephanus species, the other two >species are still so rare in cultivation that I doubt anyone has attempted >this. I suspect that such hybrids would produce some very interesting >results. > >I have no idea how variable C. haemanthoides or C. densiflorus are, but I >know that there are certain forms of C. vansonii with much darker pink >flowers than usual. > >Pieter van der Walt > -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From carlobal@netzero.net Wed Sep 12 15:18:56 2007 Message-Id: <20070912.151623.12920.0@webmail13.vgs.untd.com> From: "carlobal@netzero.net" Subject: Cryptostephanus Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 19:16:23 GMT I grow C. vansonii as well, and managed (well, it managed on its own) to set seed this year...still on the plant, taking really long to mature... Carlo A. Balistrieri The Gardens at Turtle Point Tuxedo Park, NY 10987 Zone 6 (845.351.2049) Visit: www.botanicalgardening.com From jamievande@freenet.de Wed Sep 12 16:22:00 2007 Message-Id: <46E84A69.7020303@freenet.de> From: "JamieV." Subject: pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 14 Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 22:22:01 +0200 Adam, et al, although I agree this is not really off-topic, as it concerns the traffic in ornamental plants, which is definitely what we are involved in, but to believe that these new regulations are to protect us from terrorist or genetic plots is pretty naive! If one were to actually create some form of pathogen that could be easily transmitted via plants or seeds, getting to the appropriate point of distribution would never be a big problem. The current security measures would never be able to stop a well thought out plan. Let's be realistic! We shouldn't let media propoganda mislead us. The current situation is much more to do with control of all transaction between otherwise free peoples and control as much of their daily intercourse as possible, end of subject. (or is it? Who is benefiting from these controls?. Not you and me) The unfortunate fact that phytos for small shipments have become an issue is simply fall-out of political correctness and is of little value in actually monitoring the import-export of possible pathogens. Inspecting huge shipments of organic goods has a valid point, but inspecting small shipments of garden plants/seeds is nothing short of nonsense. Now, this knowledge doesn't help any of us obtain the objects of our desire, but it should make it clear that the issue is much larger than control of a few stray seeds! What we are seeing is a world wide tightening of controls, which does effect our personal liberties. That the American people have allowed their govt. to interfere in their personal lives in the name of national security leaves the rest of the free world in absolute disbelief. One would think people would read between the lines and see the issue for what it actually is. Loss of freedom. Usurping personal and human rights. Unfortunately, this madness has spread well beyond the American borders. We are all effected. I don't want to do a soap-box, but I have. You want to have the right to import plants without undue restriction, then write hard core letters to your politicians and tell them the current situation is unacceptable! Don't let yourselves be whitewashed into believing this is in the name of national security. After all, those Monarch Butterflies were not murdered by terrorists, they were murdered by researchers that didn't have it all figured out. An unfortunate mistake, but not a terrorist attack. Such 'accidents' happen world wide, it is certainly not only the US, but the connection to gardeners like you and I simply does not exist! I expect to receive some hate mail after this, especially considering the day we have, but the point of my posting is that the situation is already out of hand. If we do not all react and attempt to regain control over our personal rights, we won't be able to raise anything in our gardens, except the local weeds! And that only with permission. Ciao, Jamie V. Cologne Adam Fikso schrieb: > Considering the importance of the phytosanitary issue , and the likelihood > of it continuing--why don't we start considering phytosanitary issues and > delays as being "on-topic"?. Apparently there is a new set of standards > being considered for international uniformity which derives its concerns not > only from terrorist concerns, but from anxiety and concern about > genetically engineered seeds and plants, which might be used as vehicles for > terrorist goals. being issued by the Secretariat of the International Plant > Proection Convention , Food and Agriculture Organizationn of the U.N.. > Jacques Diouf, Director-General. > > For example, there is current research on transgenic corn which would > carry a gene to protect against E.coli just as a result of eating it, and > another line of research which would protect against HIV infection. (Chicago > Tribune Magazine Section, September 9, 2007) . Most of you are probably > already aware of the transgenic corn pollen which destroyed thousands of > Monarch Butterflies. > > > Given this, what is to keep a bio-terrorist from using similar methods to > infect or destroy a population of people? Without answering the questions > implied here, the issue of how one guards against this bio-terrorist > eventuality by developing and writing regulations for the inspection and > transport of seed between countries becomes an enormous task. Relevant > questions for governments are: What kind of inspection is even possible? > What kinds of quarantines are facing us in the future? > > I think that much of the present concern we're seeing is motivated in part > by some of the above issues. So, growing decorative plants from seed from > other places may become much more restrictive in the near future, and > perhaps for a long time. > > From rpries@sbcglobal.net Wed Sep 12 16:36:59 2007 Message-Id: <868644.58894.qm@web81903.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: Robt R Pries Subject: pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 14 Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 13:36:58 -0700 (PDT) Jamie; Consider this love mail instead of hate mail. You said what i have been thinking much more eloquently than I could. Although there is a small amount of validity involved in the control of pathogens and invasive plants, much of this is overblown. It seems to me rather inconsequential when one considers the much larger threats of global warming. Terrorists in the larger scheme of things are pitiful annoyances but one wonders why the government is spending their energy in this type of venue when screening for nuclear devices might prevent much more than a runaway weed. It sometimes seems we can't face the real threats so we have to pick on the tiny ones to make us feel like something is being done. Plant enthusiasts seem to be quiet individuals who take much of what is thrown at them. --- "JamieV." wrote: > Adam, et al, > > although I agree this is not really off-topic, as it > concerns the > traffic in ornamental plants, which is definitely > what we are involved > in, but to believe that these new regulations are to > protect us from > terrorist or genetic plots is pretty naive! If one > were to actually > create some form of pathogen that could be easily > transmitted via plants > or seeds, getting to the appropriate point of > distribution would never > be a big problem. The current security measures > would never be able to > stop a well thought out plan. Let's be realistic! > We shouldn't let > media propoganda mislead us. > > The current situation is much more to do with > control of all transaction > between otherwise free peoples and control as much > of their daily > intercourse as possible, end of subject. (or is it? > Who is benefiting > from these controls?. Not you and me) The > unfortunate fact that phytos > for small shipments have become an issue is simply > fall-out of political > correctness and is of little value in actually > monitoring the > import-export of possible pathogens. Inspecting > huge shipments of > organic goods has a valid point, but inspecting > small shipments of > garden plants/seeds is nothing short of nonsense. > Now, this knowledge > doesn't help any of us obtain the objects of our > desire, but it should > make it clear that the issue is much larger than > control of a few stray > seeds! What we are seeing is a world wide > tightening of controls, which > does effect our personal liberties. That the > American people have > allowed their govt. to interfere in their personal > lives in the name of > national security leaves the rest of the free world > in absolute > disbelief. One would think people would read > between the lines and see > the issue for what it actually is. Loss of freedom. > Usurping personal > and human rights. Unfortunately, this madness has > spread well beyond > the American borders. We are all effected. > > I don't want to do a soap-box, but I have. You want > to have the right > to import plants without undue restriction, then > write hard core letters > to your politicians and tell them the current > situation is > unacceptable! Don't let yourselves be whitewashed > into believing this > is in the name of national security. After all, > those Monarch > Butterflies were not murdered by terrorists, they > were murdered by > researchers that didn't have it all figured out. An > unfortunate > mistake, but not a terrorist attack. Such > 'accidents' happen world > wide, it is certainly not only the US, but the > connection to gardeners > like you and I simply does not exist! > > I expect to receive some hate mail after this, > especially considering > the day we have, but the point of my posting is that > the situation is > already out of hand. If we do not all react and > attempt to regain > control over our personal rights, we won't be able > to raise anything in > our gardens, except the local weeds! And that only > with permission. > > Ciao, > > Jamie V. > Cologne > > > > Adam Fikso schrieb: > > Considering the importance of the phytosanitary > issue , and the likelihood > > of it continuing--why don't we start considering > phytosanitary issues and > > delays as being "on-topic"?. Apparently there is a > new set of standards > > being considered for international uniformity > which derives its concerns not > > only from terrorist concerns, but from anxiety and > concern about > > genetically engineered seeds and plants, which > might be used as vehicles for > > terrorist goals. being issued by the Secretariat > of the International Plant > > Proection Convention , Food and Agriculture > Organizationn of the U.N.. > > Jacques Diouf, Director-General. > > > > For example, there is current research on > transgenic corn which would > > carry a gene to protect against E.coli just as a > result of eating it, and > > another line of research which would protect > against HIV infection. (Chicago > > Tribune Magazine Section, September 9, 2007) . > Most of you are probably > > already aware of the transgenic corn pollen which > destroyed thousands of > > Monarch Butterflies. > > > > > > Given this, what is to keep a bio-terrorist from > using similar methods to > > infect or destroy a population of people? > Without answering the questions > > implied here, the issue of how one guards against > this bio-terrorist > > eventuality by developing and writing regulations > for the inspection and > > transport of seed between countries becomes an > enormous task. Relevant > > questions for governments are: What kind of > inspection is even possible? > > What kinds of quarantines are facing us in the > future? > > > > I think that much of the present concern we're > seeing is motivated in part > > by some of the above issues. So, growing > decorative plants from seed from > > other places may become much more restrictive in > the near future, and > > perhaps for a long time. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From hornig@usadatanet.net Wed Sep 12 16:53:46 2007 Message-Id: <20070912165341.22450@web1.nyc1.bluetie.com> From: "Ellen Hornig" Subject: pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 14 Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 16:53:41 -0400 Bravo to Jamie, and I will also add an observation that people can do with what they will: these regulations (phytos and inspections required for all seeds and plants) are very easily circumvented. Do people really believe that Customs carefully inspects every packet that comes through with a declaration of "gift", "research material", "costume jewelry", etc? If you do, you give the US government far more credit for efficiency than you should. I would tend to assume that that Customs and the US postal service are, like most government agencies, understaffed, underfunded, and overworked. Also human. If you were in that position, how close attention would you be paying to the packages passing, by the thousands per day, under your nose? I'm guessing coffee breaks and lunch time are far more interesting to the average employee than is the interception of unmarked illicit goods. If anyone in a position to know would like to chime in, that would be great (you can write me directly and I will post it anonymously for you, if you so prefer). Yes, there are possible (not mandatory) substantial penalties for getting caught. If anyone knows anyone who's been caught (and the package hasn't been marked "seeds" or "plants"; packets so marked DO get noticed), let us know. Now don't everyone get after me for breaking the law. I didn't say I do it. I only said it's easy to do. Ellen Ellen Hornig Seneca Hill Perennials 3712 County Route 57 Oswego NY 13126 USA Phone: 315-342-5915 Fax: 315-342-5573 Website: www.senecahillperennials.com Ellen Hornig Seneca Hill Perennials 3712 County Route 57 Oswego NY 13126 USA Phone: 315-342-5915 Fax: 315-342-5573 Website: www.senecahillperennials.com -----Original Message----- From: "Robt R Pries" [rpries@sbcglobal.net] Date: 09/12/2007 04:37 PM To: "Pacific Bulb Society" Subject: Re: [pbs] pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 14 Note: Original message sent as attachment From janemcgary@earthlink.net Wed Sep 12 18:04:01 2007 Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.0.20070912145929.01668908@mail.earthlink.net> From: Jane McGary Subject: Botanical artist wanted Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 15:03:21 -0700 I don't know if I've previously asked on this forum, but I'd like to inquire if any members know, or are themselves, good illustrators of plants who might like to do the color covers for the Rock Garden Quarterly, which I edit. Usually one artist does the four covers of one annual volume, but I'd also consider fewer contributions. There is a modest payment for one-time use of the artwork; the originals remain the property of the artist. The artist also receives publicity in the form of a contributor note and, if desired, free advertising. Please write to me PRIVATELY, NOT ON THE FORUM, if you can suggest artists. Thanks, Jane McGary Editor, NARGS From markmazerandfm13@earthlink.net Wed Sep 12 18:28:14 2007 Message-Id: <20278562.1189636094397.JavaMail.root@elwamui-hound.atl.sa.earthlink.net> From: Mark Mazer Subject: pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 14- control of pathogens Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 17:28:14 -0500 (GMT-05:00) . Although there is a small amount of >validity involved in the control of pathogens and >invasive plants, much of this is overblown. It seems >to me rather inconsequential when one considers the >much larger threats of global warming. And who would have thought that some artisian drummaker would unleash anthrax in Danbury Connecticut (and recently in NYC) recently simply by skiirting the regulations on the import of goat skins? M From janemcgary@earthlink.net Wed Sep 12 18:25:15 2007 Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.0.20070912152230.0170b2c8@mail.earthlink.net> From: Jane McGary Subject: pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 14 Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 15:29:23 -0700 Earlier correspondents are quite right that stricter enforcement of plant and seed import regulations is likely to be ineffective in thwarting "terrorism." However, it is effective in one thing that's important to the regulators: getting hold of part of the vast amount of federal funding that has been diverted to the recently established Department of Homeland Security, which administers APHIS (the agency in question, an acronym I am not making up). When administration policy veered in its current direction, many government agencies stood to lose funding, and those that could assert that in some way, however, far-fetched, their activities protected the United States from terrorism did so with alacrity in order to protect their budgets. I don't think the impetus is ideological at all; it's not an attempt to curtail individual freedom, just an attempt to hold onto staff jobs. If you think this view is too cynical, you've never worked for a publicly funded institution! Recent reports from oversight committees suggest that the truly dangerous gaps in security have not been covered by the DHS, but they've certainly made life hard for us innocent gardeners. Jane McGary Northwestern Oregon, USA From eagle85@flash.net Wed Sep 12 17:56:30 2007 Message-Id: From: Doug Westfall Subject: Dues check Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 15:52:30 -0700 To whom it concerns, Has anyone seen my dues check? It was sent 6-27-07. I have had no notice of receipt nor has it been cashed. I have received no PBS Digests. Concerned, Doug Westfall From totototo@telus.net Wed Sep 12 19:21:53 2007 Message-Id: <20070912232151.271AHNQM8K@priv-edtnaa06.telusplanet.net> From: totototo@telus.net Subject: Gummint Snoopiness Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 16:12:12 -0700 On 12 Sep 07, at 22:22, JamieV. wrote: > The current situation is much more to do with control of all > transaction between otherwise free peoples and control as much of > their daily intercourse as possible, end of subject. (or is it? > Who is benefiting from these controls?. Not you and me) My guess is marketing wonks. Once the gummint tracks all our doings, comings, goings, and periods of stasis, the info will be released to corporate marketers. "In the interests of the economy" is a likely justification. I don't think the usual tired excuse "to protect the children" will quite work in this case, but the depths to which marketers will descend are, of course, unlimited, so we may yet once again be afflicted with it. To veer back on subject: bulbs in flower chez moi: Cyclamen hederifolium, C. intaminatum; Acis autumnalis; Colchicum bornmuelleri, C. corsicum, C. byzantinum, C. b. album, and other Colchicums; Lycoris sprengeri; Amaryllis belladonna; various Crinums of uncertain identity. The crocosmias are down to just a few scattered flowers. No sign yet of operanthous crocuses. -- Rodger Whitlock Victoria, British Columbia, Canada "Outside of dogs, books are man's best friend; inside dogs, it's too dark to read." -----Groucho Marx From lwallpe@cinci.rr.com Wed Sep 12 21:03:55 2007 Message-Id: <008801c7f5a1$fa53bc80$2902a8c0@lindas> From: "Linda Wallpe" Subject: Plant Peotection Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 21:04:03 -0400 Jim et al, I noticed that Jim referred to 'multiple holes' and 'no available duct tape'. I bought some dishes recently that came from Asia. The cardboard was abysmal, flimsy stuff that had obviously been recycled multiple times. I think another way to look at this problem is to consider demanding better, more appropriate packaging. Packaging is a science now and I do believe there's a solution out there. That's my suggestion! Linda W. From peak@kth.se Thu Sep 13 04:02:33 2007 Message-Id: <002f01c7f5dc$6ceba020$804fed82@squid> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Per-=C5ke_L=F6fdahl?= Subject: Rhadamanthopsis namibensis Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:02:26 +0200 The other day I received two small bulbs labeled like this. I have not been able to find any information about their requirements, not even if they are winter or summer growing! Can anyone give me a clue? Per-Ake Lofdahl Stockholm-Sweden From arnold@nj.rr.com Thu Sep 13 09:29:38 2007 Message-Id: <46E93B32.5040106@nj.rr.com> From: Arnold Trachtenberg Subject: Rhadamanthopsis namibensis Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 09:29:22 -0400 Native to Cape Province to South Namibia. In Hyacinthaceae. Tepals mauve. Arnold From jshields@indy.net Thu Sep 13 10:13:47 2007 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20070913100345.00b15b70@pop.indy.net> From: "J.E. Shields" Subject: Rhadamanthopsis namibensis Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:13:44 -0400 At 09:29 AM 9/13/2007 -0400, Arnold wrote: >Native to Cape Province to South Namibia. In Hyacinthaceae. Tepals mauve. I'd guess that it is therefore winter-growing. This is a new one to me. I found Rhadamanthus demoted to part of Drimia, in "The Color Encyclopedia of Cape Bulbs" by Manning, Goldblatt, and Snijman, but I didn't find Rhadamanthopsis in the books I have handy. Jim Shields in central Indiana (USA) ************************************************* Jim Shields USDA Zone 5 Shields Gardens, Ltd. P.O. Box 92 WWW: http://www.shieldsgardens.com/ Westfield, Indiana 46074, USA Tel. ++1-317-867-3344 or toll-free 1-866-449-3344 in USA From jshields@indy.net Thu Sep 13 11:07:26 2007 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20070913110255.03819988@pop.indy.net> From: "J.E. Shields" Subject: Hardy Rhodophiala Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:07:23 -0400 Hi all, My pot of Rhodophiala bifida are blooming now. The ones in the ground may have disappeared. Since Rhodophiala bifida seems to be somewhat hardy outdoors year-round here in USDA zone 5, I've become more interested in the other forms of Rhodophiala. With limited greenhouse space, I'm always looking for unusual bulbs that can take our weather here outdoors. I got the bulbs in summer 2000 from Rod Barton of Hickory Creek, Texas. I planted a few in a pot and the rest in two spots outdoors. Those planted in a raised scree bed on the east side of my house did not survive the first winter. The bulbs planted out in a bed on the southeast side of some big red cedars survived and bloomed for at least 5 years. I'm not sure they bloomed last year, and there is no sign of them so far this season. Their spot is being overgrown by a large clump of Iris sanguinea, and that could have contributed to their decrease or disappearance. Some Lycoris radiata radiata were planted at the same time beside the bulbs near the cedar trees, and they continue to survive. I don't recall them blooming last year, but they too have been blooming most years since planted. The Iris sanguinea haven't gotten to these Lycoris yet. I'll watch both spots for new foliage this winter. I'd be interested in getting more bulbs of R. bifida from the colder parts of Texas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, etc., to try in other spots around my gardens. We could probably find something to trade, or I could purchase. Contact me privately at if you have some to offer. The pot of Rod's R. bifida bulbs (my number 1050) are still going strong, and put up a couple scapes this week even though they badly need repotting. I have one bloom on supposedly diploid R. bifida as well, and I'll try some cross pollination between these two accession of Rhodophiala bifida. Does anyone else have Rhodophiala (bifida or otherwise) surviving outdoors in zones 5 or 6? Please let us hear from you! Best wishes, Jim Shields in central Indiana (USA) ************************************************* Jim Shields USDA Zone 5 Shields Gardens, Ltd. P.O. Box 92 WWW: http://www.shieldsgardens.com/ Westfield, Indiana 46074, USA Tel. ++1-317-867-3344 or toll-free 1-866-449-3344 in USA From fbiasella@watertownsavings.com Thu Sep 13 15:14:13 2007 Message-Id: <000d01c7f61f$0e75f8e0$55a7f10a@wsbmain.net> From: "Fred Biasella" Subject: Hardy Rhodophiala Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:59:24 -0400 Hi Jim, I planted R. Bifida (originally from Texas) 2 years ago and they seem to be doing fine. They're planted in the sunniest possible spot in the garden along with Hippeastrum x Johnsonii and Amaryllis Belladonna (which is also in bloom as we speak). So far, R. Bifida has sent up a few leaves but I expect them to bloom shortly. Mine seem to bloom about the same time as Nerine Bowdenii and Sarniensis do. Warm Regards, Fred Biasella Cambridge (Boston) MA USDA Zone 6B -----Original Message----- From: pbs-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org [mailto:pbs-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of J.E. Shields Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 11:07 AM To: Pacific Bulb Society Subject: [pbs] Hardy Rhodophiala Hi all, My pot of Rhodophiala bifida are blooming now. The ones in the ground may have disappeared. Since Rhodophiala bifida seems to be somewhat hardy outdoors year-round here in USDA zone 5, I've become more interested in the other forms of Rhodophiala. With limited greenhouse space, I'm always looking for unusual bulbs that can take our weather here outdoors. I got the bulbs in summer 2000 from Rod Barton of Hickory Creek, Texas. I planted a few in a pot and the rest in two spots outdoors. Those planted in a raised scree bed on the east side of my house did not survive the first winter. The bulbs planted out in a bed on the southeast side of some big red cedars survived and bloomed for at least 5 years. I'm not sure they bloomed last year, and there is no sign of them so far this season. Their spot is being overgrown by a large clump of Iris sanguinea, and that could have contributed to their decrease or disappearance. Some Lycoris radiata radiata were planted at the same time beside the bulbs near the cedar trees, and they continue to survive. I don't recall them blooming last year, but they too have been blooming most years since planted. The Iris sanguinea haven't gotten to these Lycoris yet. I'll watch both spots for new foliage this winter. I'd be interested in getting more bulbs of R. bifida from the colder parts of Texas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, etc., to try in other spots around my gardens. We could probably find something to trade, or I could purchase. Contact me privately at if you have some to offer. The pot of Rod's R. bifida bulbs (my number 1050) are still going strong, and put up a couple scapes this week even though they badly need repotting. I have one bloom on supposedly diploid R. bifida as well, and I'll try some cross pollination between these two accession of Rhodophiala bifida. Does anyone else have Rhodophiala (bifida or otherwise) surviving outdoors in zones 5 or 6? Please let us hear from you! Best wishes, Jim Shields in central Indiana (USA) ************************************************* Jim Shields USDA Zone 5 Shields Gardens, Ltd. P.O. Box 92 WWW: http://www.shieldsgardens.com/ Westfield, Indiana 46074, USA Tel. ++1-317-867-3344 or toll-free 1-866-449-3344 in USA _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From peak@kth.se Thu Sep 13 14:07:12 2007 Message-Id: <1085.217.213.134.187.1189706829.squirrel@webmail.sys.kth.se> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Per-=C5ke_L=F6fdahl?= Subject: Rhadamanthopsis namibensis Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 20:07:09 +0200 (CEST) Thank you for the information Jim and Arnold! The behavior of the bulbs also suggest that it indeed is winter-growing, since they now show signs of coming into growth. I have yet to find a picture the flowers somewhere! Until I know better I will treat them like my Lachenalias. Cheers Per-Ake > I'd guess that it is therefore winter-growing. This is a new one to me. From kelly@irvincentral.com Thu Sep 13 17:28:45 2007 Message-Id: <46E9AB7D.4030008@irvincentral.com> From: Kelly Irvin Subject: Hardy Rhodophiala Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 16:28:29 -0500 Fred: Are you able to grow Nerine sarniensis in the ground outside? Mr. Kelly M. Irvin 10850 Hodge Ln Gravette, AR 72736 USA 479-787-9958 USDA Cold Hardiness Zone 6a/b mailto:kelly@irvincentral.com http://www.irvincentral.com/ Fred Biasella wrote: > Mine seem to bloom about the same time as > Nerine Bowdenii and Sarniensis do. > From wpoulsen@pacbell.net Mon Sep 17 15:22:03 2007 Message-Id: <7449a3ccc04edb447e31b10c0b6ae5ca@pacbell.net> From: Lee Poulsen Subject: Species names for sale Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 12:22:01 -0700 Has anyone considered this for new plant (or bulb) species? --Lee Poulsen Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a http://www.nature.com/news/2007/070910/full/070910-9.html Published online: 13 September 2007; | doi:10.1038/news070910-9 Fish for sale Non-profits auction species names for conservation. Geoff Brumfiel Over the years, philanthropists have lent their names to art galleries, schools and hospitals. But in a watershed auction, the world's rich will be able to add their names to several new species of fish — all in the name of charity. On Thursday 20 September, an auction to name ten new species of fish is being held by the Monaco-based Monaco-Asia Society, a non-profit organization devoted to Asian causes and Conservation International, based in Arlington, Virginia. The fish are a few of the dozens discovered by Conservation International during expeditions to reefs off the coast of Indonesia's Papua Province in 2006. Bidders will arrive from around the world for a gala at Monaco's Oceanographic Museum, which sits on a bluff high above the Mediterranean Ocean. Prince Albert II will be in attendance, and auction house Christie's will oversee the bidding pro-bono. This isn't the first auction for a species name. For example, in 2005 an anonymous online bidder won the right to name a new kind of Bolivian monkey for a charitable donation of US$650,000. But this is the first time that multiple species will be auctioned in a single event, according to Monaco-Asia Society president Francesco Bongiovanni. There's nothing wrong with naming an animal after the rich and famous, says Andrew Polaszek, executive secretary at the International Commission on Zoological Nomenclature in London. The only technical requirements, he says, are that the name must have a generic and specific part and be published in a paper or monograph — something that Conservation International will presumably do. Species are routinely named after famous scientists, and one species of cave beetle is even named after Adolf Hitler. He says that "you can essentially name a species anything you want". Bongiovanni says he hopes the gala will raise US$1.2-1.4 million for further expeditions and conservation efforts in the region. But is it fair to name a species after a wealthy patron, rather than the scientist who discovered or described it? Bongiovanni says yes — especially because it is all for the greater good of the fish. "At the end of the day," he says, "these species need names." © 2006 Nature Publishing Group From carlobal@netzero.net Mon Sep 17 15:30:37 2007 Message-Id: <20070917.152937.14969.0@webmail13.vgs.untd.com> From: "carlobal@netzero.net" Subject: Species names for sale Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 19:29:37 GMT It's been done. The New York Botanical Garden auctions off a new hemerocallis every year with the chance to name the cultivar... Carlo A. Balistrieri The Gardens at Turtle Point Tuxedo Park, NY 10987 Zone 6 (845.351.2049) Visit: www.botanicalgardening.com From carlobal@netzero.net Mon Sep 17 15:34:53 2007 Message-Id: <20070917.153311.14969.1@webmail13.vgs.untd.com> From: "carlobal@netzero.net" Subject: Species names for sale Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 19:33:11 GMT ...and I'm sure it's been done for plants elsewhere. The cultivar name I don't mind...but there's something vaguely disturbing about auctioning the right to name a species formally. In addition, there are all the formal rules to follow... Carlo A. Balistrieri The Gardens at Turtle Point Tuxedo Park, NY 10987 Zone 6 (845.351.2049) Visit: www.botanicalgardening.com From auchgourishgardens@falsyde.sol.co.uk Mon Sep 17 15:55:32 2007 Message-Id: <03de01c7f964$a26d33e0$0401a8c0@TERMINAL4> From: Subject: Favorite Seed & Bulb Sources Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 20:55:01 +0100 Please send me your lists of seeds and bulbs. Thank you, Iain Brodie of Falsyde Auchgourish Botanic Garden & Arboretum From jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Mon Sep 17 16:37:19 2007 Message-Id: <000001c7f96a$b1ed3170$2f01a8c0@Library> From: "Jim McKenney" Subject: Species names for sale Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 16:38:23 -0400 Naming plants and animals for money is nothing new. The auction aspect merely adds to the post modern crassness of it. In the past, starving botanists and zoologists who worked for wealthy patrons often named things for their employer. Now days the starving botanists and zoologists are more apt to work for a university or museum; and presumably their level of starvation is only relative to what goes on in the private sector rather than absolute. The practice has now sunk to the level of mutual back-scratching among peers. Centuries ago, in pre-Linnaean times, when biologists wrote in Latin because it was widely understood across national borders, it was often necessary to make reference to taxonomic concepts developed by other workers, taxonomic concepts which did not have universal acceptance. No taxonomic concepts back then probably had any more than local acceptance. Thus Albertus (all of the names which follow are fictitious) in the Netherlands might sketch the genera of birds one way, Salvator in Italy might sketch them in another way, Grünberg in Germany yet another way. When referring to these various classifications, the norm was to cite the taxon and then follow it with the genitive form of the author's name. Thus there might have been references to Nucifranga alberti, Passer nucivorus salvatori and Olethrokaryon gruenbergi. Citations like these are not to be understood as binomial species names in the modern sense, but rather in the senses of "Nucifranga in the sense of Albertus", "Passer nucivorus in the sense of Salvator" or "Olethrokaryon in the sense of Grünberg". [And here's a totally off-topic grammar rant related to the above: I think there are editors who would correct the above to "Nucifranga in the sense of Albertus's", "Passer...in the sense of Salvator's" and "Olethrokaryon in the sense of Grünberg's. That one drives me crazy.] In post Linnaean times the practice of naming organisms for persons not actively involved in research began to spread, and once the practical utility of such "honorifics" was realized, there was no going back. Now days there are a lot of really pathetic taxonomists out there who name things according to formulas. For instance, often when the newspapers announce the discovery of a new dinosaur the genus name follows the pattern name of person + saurus, species name location + ensis or some variation or other combination of those basic elements, including the name of person + i. A once literate, poetic tradition has been largely debased. Those of you who follow the Agatha Christie adaptations in which Joan Hickson plays the role of Miss Marple perhaps remember the episode in which one of the character's claim to fame is that a species (or, as his wife continually reminds him, a subspecies) of butterfly has been named for him. In her view it's evidently not much of an honor. It's certainly not in my mind, either. Jim McKenney jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Montgomery County, Maryland, USA, USDA zone 7, where Sternbergia lutea is about to bloom. My Virtual Maryland Garden http://www.jimmckenney.com BLOG! http://mcwort.blogspot.com/ Webmaster Potomac Valley Chapter, NARGS Editor PVC Bulletin http://www.pvcnargs.org Webmaster Potomac Lily Society http://www.potomaclilysociety.org From kelly@irvincentral.com Mon Sep 17 19:01:03 2007 Message-Id: <46EF0722.2080002@irvincentral.com> From: Kelly Irvin Subject: Species names for sale Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 18:00:50 -0500 Hmmm, Jim. I don't... know... ... Lycoris irvinii would suit me nicely! I'll give 25¢ to anyone who will name one for me. Mr. Kelly M. Irvin 10850 Hodge Ln Gravette, AR 72736 USA 479-787-9958 USDA Cold Hardiness Zone 6a/b mailto:kelly@irvincentral.com http://www.irvincentral.com/ Jim McKenney wrote: > Those of you who follow the Agatha Christie adaptations in which Joan > Hickson plays the role of Miss Marple perhaps remember the episode in which > one of the character's claim to fame is that a species (or, as his wife > continually reminds him, a subspecies) of butterfly has been named for him. > In her view it's evidently not much of an honor. > > It's certainly not in my mind, either. > > Jim McKenney > jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com > Montgomery County, Maryland, USA, USDA zone 7, where Sternbergia lutea is > about to bloom. > My Virtual Maryland Garden http://www.jimmckenney.com > BLOG! http://mcwort.blogspot.com/ > > Webmaster Potomac Valley Chapter, NARGS > Editor PVC Bulletin http://www.pvcnargs.org > > Webmaster Potomac Lily Society http://www.potomaclilysociety.org > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > From ggroiti@mail.agro.uba.ar Mon Sep 17 19:40:00 2007 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.1.20070917203843.01afe448@mail.agro.uba.ar> From: German Roitman Subject: Species names for sale Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 20:40:10 -0300 I have two new species of South American Iridaceae ready to publish, should i open an auction? Best wishes Germán At 20:00 17/09/2007, you wrote: >Hmmm, Jim. I don't... know... ... Lycoris irvinii would suit me nicely! >I'll give 25¢ to anyone who will name one for me. > >Mr. Kelly M. Irvin >10850 Hodge Ln >Gravette, AR 72736 >USA > >479-787-9958 >USDA Cold Hardiness Zone 6a/b > >mailto:kelly@irvincentral.com >http://www.irvincentral.com/ > > > >Jim McKenney wrote: > > Those of you who follow the Agatha Christie adaptations in which Joan > > Hickson plays the role of Miss Marple > perhaps remember the episode in which > > one of the character's claim to fame is that a species (or, as his wife > > continually reminds him, a subspecies) of butterfly has been named for him. > > In her view it's evidently not much of an honor. > > > > It's certainly not in my mind, either. > > > > Jim McKenney > > jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com > > Montgomery County, Maryland, USA, USDA zone 7, where Sternbergia lutea is > > about to bloom. > > My Virtual Maryland Garden http://www.jimmckenney.com > > BLOG! http://mcwort.blogspot.com/ > > > > Webmaster Potomac Valley Chapter, NARGS > > Editor PVC Bulletin http://www.pvcnargs.org > > > > Webmaster Potomac Lily Society http://www.potomaclilysociety.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > pbs mailing list > > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > > > >_______________________________________________ >pbs mailing list >pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG Free Edition. >Version: 7.5.487 / Virus Database: >269.13.22/1013 - Release Date: 17/09/2007 13:29 From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Mon Sep 17 22:01:25 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Species names for ..... Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 20:45:13 -0500 As a semi-aside.. Linneaus named at least a few genera for friends. Bauhinia - the orchid tree has leaves composed to identical halves. This is named for the Bauhin twins - identical. Tillandsia is a bromeliad that seems to exist on almost no water and sits on trees away from liquid. It was named for his assistant who had a fear of water a Mr. Tillands. And there are others I can't recall. My favorite is the big 'ugly' beetle named in Honor of Gary Larson, originator of the Far Side. If you know The Far Side you understand. Any organism can be named for anything as long as it fills the rules and is done according to rules. Don't the orchid genus Dracula flowers remind you of 'something'? On and on. And there's more than a few that verge on risque'. Best Jim W. -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From odysseybulbs@earthlink.net Mon Sep 17 22:35:57 2007 Message-Id: From: "Russell Stafford, Odyssey Bulbs" Subject: Species names for ..... Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 22:35:55 -0400 Pinus lambertii, for one.... Russell At 09:45 PM 9/17/2007, you wrote: > On and on. And there's more than a few that verge on risque'. > Best Jim W. >-- >Dr. James W. Waddick >8871 NW Brostrom Rd. >Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 >USA >Ph. 816-746-1949 >Zone 5 Record low -23F > Summer 100F + Russell Stafford Odyssey Bulbs PO Box 382 South Lancaster, MA 01561 508-335-8106 From khixson@nu-world.com Mon Sep 17 23:07:49 2007 Message-Id: <46EF4102.409@nu-world.com> From: Kenneth Hixson Subject: Species names for sale Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 20:07:46 -0700 Hi, All Lee wrote: >Has anyone considered this for new plant (or bulb) species? David Austen auctioned off the right to name a number of his new English shrub roses. In at least a few instances, the money was donated to charity. He writes of one couple "winning" the auction, and naming the rose for their daughter who had died. In the Rose Hybridizers group, there have been at least a couple people offering to buy the right to name a new rose--no color or type specified. There was a small discussion about whether or not this was an acceptable/ desirable thing or not--from the hybridizer's standpoint. So, yes, it happens. Whether or not someone would sell the rights to something they value highly, is debatable--hybridizers will usually fight (file lawsuits in court) to keep their name associated with their productions. Probably very few of the plants so named ever make it to market, partly because they are good, but not quite good enough, and partly because it usually needs an organization promoting a new plant, and individuals usually do not have the experience or money to market a new plant. Thus, the name ends up cluttering up lists, but not markets. Jim Waddick mentioned the orchid genera Dracula--well, one botanist with a sense of humor named a species vampira--Dracula vampira. So, one of the clones of this species was of course named Bela Lugosi, Dracula vampira 'Bela Lugosi'. I believe there was another clone named in similar fashion, but I've forgotten..... Ken From carlobal@netzero.net Mon Sep 17 23:19:29 2007 Message-Id: <20070917.231853.25944.0@webmail12.vgs.untd.com> From: "carlobal@netzero.net" Subject: Species names for sale Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 03:18:53 GMT I've grown Dracula vampira...and the name fits. Carlo A. Balistrieri The Gardens at Turtle Point Tuxedo Park, NY 10987 Zone 6 (845.351.2049) Visit: www.botanicalgardening.com From zigur@hotmail.com Mon Sep 17 23:36:59 2007 Message-Id: From: Tim Harvey Subject: Species names for ..... Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 20:36:58 -0700 If you think Botanists have a hard time coming up with names ... http://home.earthlink.net/~misaak/taxonomy.html T> Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 22:35:55 -0400> To: pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> From: odysseybulbs@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: [pbs] Species names for .....> > Pinus lambertii, for one....> > Russell> > At 09:45 PM 9/17/2007, you wrote:> > On and on. And there's more than a few that verge on risque'.> > Best Jim W.> >--> >Dr. James W. Waddick> >8871 NW Brostrom Rd.> >Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711> >USA> >Ph. 816-746-1949> >Zone 5 Record low -23F> > Summer 100F +> > Russell Stafford> Odyssey Bulbs> PO Box 382> South Lancaster, MA 01561> 508-335-8106 > > _______________________________________________> pbs mailing list> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From msittner@mcn.org Tue Sep 18 10:35:42 2007 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.2.20070918072941.031d6038@mail.mcn.org> From: Mary Sue Ittner Subject: List and Wiki Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 07:35:12 -0700 Hi, I'll be away for the next four weeks. Please contact Diane Whitehead, email - voltaire at islandnet.com, or Arnold Trachtenberg, email - Arnold at nj.rr.com, if you need help with the list and Jay Yourch, email: jyourch at nc.rr.com if you need help with the wiki. Mary Sue From totototo@telus.net Tue Sep 18 13:51:15 2007 Message-Id: <20070918175114.90LTUXAP72@priv-edmwaa05.telusplanet.net> From: totototo@telus.net Subject: Species names for sale Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 10:51:02 -0700 On 17 Sep 07, at 20:07, Kenneth Hixson wrote: > In the Rose Hybridizers group, there have been at least a > couple people offering to buy the right to name a new rose--no color > or type specified. There was a small discussion about whether or > not this was an acceptable/ desirable thing or not--from the > hybridizer's standpoint. It's an old practice. The rose 'Electron' is (was) called 'Mullard Jubilee' in Britain, being named in honor of the Mullard company, a one-time manufacturer of electronic equipment. Those of us who had the big ol' Dynaco Stereo 70 amplifiers back in the 1960's will remember chasing down Mullard 5C4 tubes for the output stage. (I hope I've got that tube designation right!) To veer almost back on topic, what would be appropriate bulbous genera to bear cultivar names relating to our favorite computer companies? Crocus chrysanthus 'Linux'? Lycoris 'Torvalds'? Tulipa 'Microsoft'? Amorphophallus 'Apple'? Crocosmia 'Job's Tears'? Convallaria 'Ballmer's Rants'? Dahlia 'Gates's Wealth'? Narcissus 'Vista'? Acis 'Chi-rho'? (That's XP.) [If anybody thinks I've gone off my nut, they're right. I amuse myself way, way too easily.] -- Rodger Whitlock Victoria, British Columbia, Canada "Outside of dogs, books are man's best friend; inside dogs, it's too dark to read." -----Groucho Marx From dells@voicenet.com Tue Sep 18 16:51:05 2007 Message-Id: <20070918205054.CEF874C016@lists.ibiblio.org> From: "Dell Sherk" Subject: Pacific BX 153 Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 16:50:22 -0400 Dear All, The items listed below have been donated by our members to be shared. If you are interested in obtaining some of them, please email me PRIVATELY at . Include "BX 153" in the subject line. Specify the NUMBERS of the items which you would like; do not specify quantities. It is a good idea to include your snail mail address, too, in case I don't already have it. Availability is based on a first come, first served system. When you receive your seeds/bulbs you will find, included with them, a statement of how much money (usually $2.00/item) (cash, check, or Pay Pal to ; no money orders, please) you should send the PBS treasurer to defray our costs for packing and first-class, priority-mail, or international postage. PLEASE NOTE: NEW POSTAL-RATE SCHEMES NECESSITATE OUR PLACING A SURCHARGE ON EACH ORDER FROM PBS BX OFFERINGS. Some of you are members of the online PBS discussion forum but are not members of the Pacific Bulb Society. THIS BX OFFERING IS AVAILABLE ONLY TO MEMBERS OF THE PBS. Consider joining the PBS so that you can take advantage of future offers such as this. Go to our website: .... If you would like to donate seeds or bulbs/corms to the PBS,(Donors will receive credit on the BX for the cost of postage for their donations.), please send CLEAN, clearly labeled material to: Dell Sherk 6832 Phillips Mill Rd. New Hope, PA, 18938 USA I WILL REPLY TO YOU WITHIN 24 HRS OF MY RECEIPT OF YOUR ORDER. IF YOU DO NOT HEAR FROM ME, TRY AGAIN !! From John Lonsdale: SEED: 1. Trillium underwoodii, Alabama Best Form 2. Trillium discolor 3. Cyclamen graecum album 4. Cyclamen graecum graecum 5. Cyclamen graecum anatolicum 6. Cyclamen hederifolium 7. Cyclamen cilicicum 8. Cyclamen repandum 9. Cyclamen intaminatum 10. Cyclamen coum selected 11. Cyclamen mirabile ex 'Tile Barn Anne' 12. Cyclamen mirabile ex 'Tile Barn Nicholas' From Pat Bender: 13. Seed of Arisaema griffithii From Mark Mazer: SEED: 14. Calydorea amabilis 15. Cyrtanthus loddegesianus 16. Sparaxis metelerkampiae 17. Sparaxis parviflora 18. Lapeirousia jaquinii 19. Lachenalia glaucina 20. Lachenalia juncifolia 21. Lachenalia sp., white flower, late bloom 22. Androcymbium dregii BULBLETS/CORMLETS: 23. Sparaxis villosa 24. Sparaxis pauciflora 25. Ixia pumilo 26. Massonia depressa From Giorgio Pozzi: SEED: 27. Rudbeckia sp? 28. Lilium orientale hybs mix 29. Cornus florida 30. Acer palmatum atropurpurea From Dell Sherk: 31. Scaly rhizomes of Koellikeria erinoides. Gesneriad with dark green, furry leaves with tiny white spots and many racemes of small white flowers with red spots that smell like coconut. Thank you, John, Pat, Mark, and Giorgio !! Best wishes, Dell Dell Sherk, Director, PBS BX From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Tue Sep 18 17:52:34 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Pacific BX 153 Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 16:49:41 -0500 RE BX 153 And thank you Dell. Jim W. From Dell Sherk: 31. Scaly rhizomes of Koellikeria erinoides. Gesneriad with dark green, furry leaves with tiny white spots and many racemes of small white flowers with red spots that smell like coconut. Thank you, John, Pat, Mark, and Giorgio !! -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From ppbender@comcast.net Tue Sep 18 19:17:20 2007 Message-Id: From: Patricia Bender Subject: Pacific BX 153 Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 16:15:23 -0700 Sorry for having sent the order to the group Pat Bender From aaron_floden@yahoo.com Tue Sep 18 22:05:54 2007 Message-Id: <562514.39771.qm@web34305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: aaron floden Subject: Species names for sale Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 19:05:53 -0700 (PDT) As far as naming plants for people it was and still is commonplace. Normally it is done in the case of a new species in a group that someone has devoted most of their botany career to and someone else discovers a new species within that genus. I almost did that with a species I am describing, but when I found old collections of this same thing I nixed that idea and went with something somewhat descriptive. Botanists get the honor of their name being affixed to the species even if they are not allowed to name it for themselves, which would seem overly vain and not very botanist like. As for names being bought or sold, a new Trillium is being named after the owner of the property who, from what I was told, was offered the 'honor' for several thousand dollars. The property owner happens to be a very wealthy conservationist (in the sense that wild plants should stay wild). Aaron Floden Knoxville, TN > > > one of the character's claim to fame is that a > species (or, as his wife > > > continually reminds him, a subspecies) of > butterfly has been named for him. > > > In her view it's evidently not much of an honor. > > > > > > It's certainly not in my mind, either. > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join our Network Research Panel today! http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 From piabinha@yahoo.com Tue Sep 18 22:21:01 2007 Message-Id: <549876.78022.qm@web51906.mail.re2.yahoo.com> From: piaba Subject: Koellikeria (Pacific BX 153) Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 19:21:01 -0700 (PDT) according to a recent paper, the genus Koellikeria has been subsumed under Gloxinia now, which now has only 3 species (various other species in the genus were placed into other genera, some new, some ressurrected). see wikipedia article with citation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gloxinia_%28genus%29 > 31. Scaly rhizomes of Koellikeria erinoides. > Gesneriad with dark green, > furry leaves with tiny white spots and many racemes > of small white flowers > with red spots that smell like coconut. > ========= tsuh yang ____________________________________________________________________________________ Don't let your dream ride pass you by. Make it a reality with Yahoo! Autos. http://autos.yahoo.com/index.html From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Wed Sep 19 10:06:04 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Off Topic - Fishing - Chinese Lycoris Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2007 08:39:36 -0500 Dear Friends, After years of nagging many Chinese friends. I have a potential source for importing some interesting and uncommon Chinese Lycoris species. I am just sort of wondering what interest is out there. Rather than 'sell' anything - even a possibility - please contact me privately at jwaddick@kc.rr.com for details or guesses at details. Thanks and best Jim W. -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From jwaddick@kc.rr.com Wed Sep 19 10:06:07 2007 Message-Id: From: James Waddick Subject: Pacific BX 153 THANKS TO DELL Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2007 08:40:17 -0500 Dear All, I guess I was NOT clear enough in thanking Dell. He thanked all the contributors, except Dell, himself. Thanks to Dell for his latest contribution and ALL he does to keep the BX running smoothly. Didn't mean to sound like I was 'placing an order' for anything And .. by the way ... I hope people who get stuff from Dell realize the value of these donations.Many of the items are either VERY rare or not available commercially. I bet a month's worth of donations would cost thousands of dollars on the market. Thanks to Dell and PBS for this excellent offer to members. Best Jim W. -- Dr. James W. Waddick 8871 NW Brostrom Rd. Kansas City Missouri 64152-2711 USA Ph. 816-746-1949 Zone 5 Record low -23F Summer 100F + From maxwithers@gmail.com Wed Sep 19 12:46:40 2007 Message-Id: <46F15263.10900@gmail.com> From: Max Withers Subject: what is the opposite of contractile? Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2007 09:46:27 -0700 There is an interesting discussion on the mediterranean plants list about bulbs that that seem to push themselves out of the soil, occasioned by Drimia (Urginea) maritima: http://www.hort.net/lists/medit-plants/sep07/subject.html Anyone have any theories about why some bulbs do this (some of the S. African Amaryllids also come to mind)? Someone pointed out that just because a plant can do something does not necessarily mean there is an adaptive reason to do it. Best, Max Oakland From janemcgary@earthlink.net Wed Sep 19 13:50:22 2007 Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.0.20070919104759.016c8010@mail.earthlink.net> From: Jane McGary Subject: what is the opposite of contractile? Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2007 10:54:28 -0700 Max asked about Drimia maritima and its tendency to rise to the surface. Possibly bulbs that "push" themselves out of the soil evolved in situations of highly mobile soils, such as dunes or repeatedly flooded zones, and this strategy keeps the bulb at an optimal level where it will not be buried too deeply and have to expend too much stored energy extending its leaves and scape to the increasingly distant surface. This would apply to Drimia maritima in one of its habitats, coastal dunes, but it also grows in rocky situations that appear quite stable. Because sheep and goats don't eat it, it probably has spread into habitats that would have been occupied by other plants before human activity changed the environment. Other geophytes found in very mobile situations, such as riverbanks and scree, often reproduce vegetatively by stolons or very elongated bulbs (e.g., certain riparian Lilium species). Jane McGary Northwestern Oregon, USA From rdjenkins@bellsouth.net Wed Sep 19 14:16:23 2007 Message-Id: <000e01c7fae9$22a28a30$6101a8c0@JenkinsMachine> From: "rdjenkins" Subject: Crinum scabrum:winter storage? Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2007 14:15:58 -0400 Last year I grew all my C. scabrum in pots. This year, I planted them out. Now 'tis time to dig them up for winter storage. Last winter they were stored bone dry in their pots. In spring, I removed the plants, with root ball and soil intact, and recall that I could see some live roots round the edges. So, should I store them in a dry medium (vermiculite) in order to preserve the roots (which I am assuming it will, as did the dry rootball)? I received the bulbs without "root one" two years ago Was this probably due to storage without any covering on the roots? Any advice or tips? Robert. From totototo@telus.net Thu Sep 20 12:12:51 2007 Message-Id: <20070920161249.95MRQP9L30@priv-edmwaa05.telusplanet.net> From: totototo@telus.net Subject: what is the opposite of contractile? Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 09:12:32 -0700 On 19 Sep 07, at 9:46, Max Withers wrote: > There is an interesting discussion on the mediterranean plants list > about bulbs that that seem to push themselves out of the soil, > occasioned by Drimia (Urginea) maritima: > > http://www.hort.net/lists/medit-plants/sep07/subject.html > > Anyone have any theories about why some bulbs do this (some of the S. > African Amaryllids also come to mind)? Someone pointed out that just > because a plant can do something does not necessarily mean there is an > adaptive reason to do it. You don't have to go that far to find an example. Galanthus nivalis often pushes bulbs to the surface, and I've even seen Narcissus cultivars do the same. The physical mechanism seems to be overly exuberant production of offsets until crowding forces some onto the surface. The adaptive value is that doing so facilitates asexual reproduction. Commercial bulbs of /Iris danfordiae/ are notorious for breaking up into "rice grains" unless planted very deeply. My guess is that this too is a strategy for facilitating asexual reproduction when the bulbs are near the soil surface. -- RFW "It's MY computer, Mr Gates. Stop trying to tell me what it will/won't do." From Jonathan.Knisely@yale.edu Thu Sep 20 13:50:09 2007 Message-Id: <46F2B2D0.7010907@yale.edu> From: Jonathan Knisely Subject: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 12:50:08 -0500 I have tubers I grew from seed of C. hederifolium and I'm wondering about the appropriate depth to plant them outside in where I hope they will naturalize and thrive. I have had tubers of C. hederifolium and C. Coum that froze to mush during the past winter's cold snaps in my USDA 6a climate. These sadly departed geophytes were planted with the top of the tuber barely covered, and were located in a bed of Meehania cordata, with evergreen branches strewn atop the bed to improve their chances of surviving winter cold. The tubers range in size from about 7-15 mm in diameter. I fear that if I plant them too deeply, there will be problems with emergence of foliage (and flowers) that will result in the demise of the tuber. Can anyone provide practical recommendations that will help me as I'm crouching in my border? Jonathan Knisely New Haven, CT From john@johnlonsdale.net Thu Sep 20 14:20:22 2007 Message-Id: <00f901c7fbb2$0016c070$6801a8c0@XPS400> From: "John T Lonsdale" Subject: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:13:51 -0400 Hi, I'm a little surprised to hear that neither coum nor hederifolium survived last winter. You are colder than us here in SE Pennsylvania, but not so much more that I'd expect that to happen. Cold hardiness is very much influenced by drainage - was the ground these tubers were in at all soggy? Freezing and thawing in less than perfectly well-drained ground could cause you to lose plants that would be hardy with perfect drainage in a garden a zone colder. On our S facing perfectly drained hillside I have a number of hederifolium that are 25-50% exposed to the air - they look like flying saucers that have crashed into the slope and stuck half-way in. They are up to 8" diameter - but they come through the winters just fine. I'd try to optimize the situation and drainage - and then you can certainly plant deeper as well if you want, as long as whatever is on top drains perfectly then the flowers and leaves will find a way through. You could put up to 6" of pure gravel on top of them without issue - but don't create a sump for water to gather on top of the tubers. Good luck! J. John T Lonsdale PhD 407 Edgewood Drive, Exton, Pennsylvania 19341, USA Home: 610 594 9232 Cell: 484 678 9856 Fax: 801 327 1266 Visit "Edgewood" - The Lonsdale Garden at http://www.edgewoodgardens.net USDA Zone 6b From rherold@yahoo.com Thu Sep 20 14:28:12 2007 Message-Id: <775569.19646.qm@web62409.mail.re1.yahoo.com> From: Roy Herold Subject: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 11:28:11 -0700 (PDT) Jonathan, In my own Zone 5B/6A garden , I plant them with the tops of the tubers a couple of inches deep. More is okay, less is bad. Hederifolium puts out roots from the top and sides of the tuber, unlike coum and the like which have roots on the bottom surface only. Don't worry, the foliage and flowers will make it up through most anything. I've rescued tubers from seeds that germinated six inches deep in a pot, and tiny filament-like leaves somehow make it to the surface. I have planted Cyclamen hederifolum all over my garden, and they appear to be happy in some spots, and a disaster in others. The best locations seem to be on a north facing slope under a japanese maple, and on top of the septic tank (a little extra warmth?). The ants seem to find good locations, too, and volunteers are thriving in some very unlikely spots. In addition to hed, coum, cilicium, and purparascens seem to be the best for naturalizing in this way, and love coarse gravel as a seed bed. It always pains me to run the lawnmower over the coums in the lawn, but the ants drag them out there, too. One final tip is to try to find a spot that doesn't get any direct sun in the winter. Sunlight makes the normal freeze/thaw cycles in NE even worse. Good luck with your planting. My own goal is to get pseudibericum going outside one of these days. It was happy in an unheated cold frame last winter, so should be worth a try. --Roy NW of Boston Snow cover? Hah! Unreliable at best... C. rohlfsianum just coming into bloom... ----- Original Message ---- From: Jonathan Knisely To: pbs@lists.ibiblio.org Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2007 1:50:08 PM Subject: [pbs] Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth I have tubers I grew from seed of C. hederifolium and I'm wondering about the appropriate depth to plant them outside in where I hope they will naturalize and thrive. I have had tubers of C. hederifolium and C. Coum that froze to mush during the past winter's cold snaps in my USDA 6a climate. These sadly departed geophytes were planted with the top of the tuber barely covered, and were located in a bed of Meehania cordata, with evergreen branches strewn atop the bed to improve their chances of surviving winter cold. The tubers range in size from about 7-15 mm in diameter. I fear that if I plant them too deeply, there will be problems with emergence of foliage (and flowers) that will result in the demise of the tuber. Can anyone provide practical recommendations that will help me as I'm crouching in my border? Jonathan Knisely New Haven, CT _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From john@johnlonsdale.net Thu Sep 20 14:33:17 2007 Message-Id: <00fa01c7fbb4$b37df550$6801a8c0@XPS400> From: "John T Lonsdale" Subject: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:33:11 -0400 Roy, Just FYI - C. pseudibericum grows well outside here and is seeding around gently in the garden, so is certainly worth a try outside. Best, John John T Lonsdale PhD 407 Edgewood Drive, Exton, Pennsylvania 19341, USA Home: 610 594 9232 Cell: 484 678 9856 Fax: 801 327 1266 Visit "Edgewood" - The Lonsdale Garden at http://www.edgewoodgardens.net USDA Zone 6b From rarebulbs@suddenlink.net Thu Sep 20 15:08:57 2007 Message-Id: <001401c7fbb8$d4b73840$ed396f4b@DJ9SK221> From: "Diana Chapman" Subject: South American Bulbs Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 12:02:45 -0700 Dear All: For those within reach of the San Francisco Bay Area, I will be giving a presentation on November 19, 2007, entitled "Treasures of the Andes: Bulbs of South America" cosponsored by the San Francisco Botanical Garden Society and the California Horticultural Society. The time is 7:45pm, place is San Francisco County Fair Building (Hall of Flowers), 9th Avenue & Lincoln way, San Francisco, CA. The talk is preceded by a stroll around Strybing Arboretum and Botanical Gardens at 4:00pm, then dinner at a nearby restaurant. You don't have to be a member to attend. I will be taking a selection of bulbs for sale at prices reduced from the catalogue, and, hopefully, some that are not presently listed. There is a drawing, to which I am contributing a small Pamianthe peruviana. I hope some members can make it to the meeting. The walk around the Arboretum and the dinner gives everyone an opportunity to meet. Diana Telos Rare Bulbs From aaron_floden@yahoo.com Thu Sep 20 15:18:07 2007 Message-Id: <105120.40590.qm@web34310.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: aaron floden Subject: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 12:18:00 -0700 (PDT) Hello, I had C.pseudibericum winter in Kansas for three years. It started as a single seedling from the Archibalds highest altitude collection after I dumped the two year old un-germinated pot. The tuber was quarter-sized after 3 years and is now planted in the garden here in TN. Purpurascens was by far the best in Kansas, and seems content here so far also. Hederifolium was always iffy in Kansas living about 2 years on average. Coum I got to bloom once, but always died in early spring or summer. Aaron Floden Knoxville, TN --- John T Lonsdale wrote: > Just FYI - C. pseudibericum grows well outside here > and is seeding around > gently in the garden, so is certainly worth a try > outside. > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Check out the hottest 2008 models today at Yahoo! Autos. http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html From wpoulsen@pacbell.net Thu Sep 20 16:34:01 2007 Message-Id: <9f5cb79dc3c98101a99aea484c6804f3@pacbell.net> From: Lee Poulsen Subject: Amsterdam bulbing Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 13:33:54 -0700 I know it's the wrong season to see all the wonderful flower displays, but next week I'll be in Amsterdam on business and was wondering if there is anything at this time of the year bulb or plant related that might be worth seeing (and possibly dragging non-plantophile co-workers along to see)? Or even non-plant-related things that would be worth going to see when we're not otherwise occupied with work? Thanks for any suggestions. --Lee Poulsen Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a From arnold@nj.rr.com Thu Sep 20 17:11:20 2007 Message-Id: <46F2E1E6.8050807@nj.rr.com> From: Arnold Trachtenberg Subject: Amsterdam bulbing Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:11:02 -0400 Lee: Your forgetting the possible displays of fall blooming bulbs like Crocus and Colchicums. Arnold From dells@voicenet.com Thu Sep 20 17:14:32 2007 Message-Id: <20070920211427.DB4AB4C01D@lists.ibiblio.org> From: "Dell Sherk" Subject: Pacific BX 153 CLOSED Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:14:14 -0400 Dear All, Everything is claimed in this lot. Packages should go out after the weekend. Enjoy, Dell Dell Sherk, Director, PBS BX From j.grimshaw@virgin.net Fri Sep 21 01:42:41 2007 Message-Id: <001901c7fc12$37ed2dd0$0201a8c0@John> From: "John Grimshaw" Subject: Amsterdam bulbing Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 06:42:36 +0100 Lee - there are all sorts of things to look at in Amsterdam... some of them are very bulbous. Much depends on how long you have for exploring. If you could get to the flower auction in Aalsmeer that would be an interesting experience. Funnily enough I never went to an actual auction while I lived in Holland, but used to love visiting the wholesale florists and plant-sellers who occupy part of the cavernous auction building - see http://www.cultra.nl/. There you get a concentrated experience of the Dutch horticultural industry as they sell something of everything that passes through the auction to smaller traders/florists etc who don't need 10,000 roses all at once. You can just walk in and prowl about but you need an account to buy anything. What they offer of course depends on season but is always amazing. I once was able to buy bunches (50 in each) of Oncocyclus irises, imported from Israel. In Amsterdam itself the floating flower market is interesting, even if touristy, & there are a couple of bulb sellers. To those accustomed to the dullness of an English or American florist's offerings a visit to even a local Dutch florist's shop is a revelation. For a non plant-related activity Amsterdam is of course full of cultural interest, which could be combined with a horticultural theme. You could go to the Rijksmuseum to study flowers in old flower pieces - not to mention the Rembrandts etc. There are some surprising plant images in the Van Gogh Museum too. For food I would recommend an Indonesian meal - the Dutch East Indies connection is quite strong. I used to go to Sampurna, an Indonesian restaurant (www.sampurna.com) by the flower market and have a rijsttafel - a selection of all sorts of small dishes of delicious things. Let us know how you get on! John Grimshaw Dr John M. Grimshaw Sycamore Cottage Colesbourne Nr Cheltenham Gloucestershire GL53 9NP From dejager@bulbargence.com Fri Sep 21 02:00:58 2007 Message-Id: From: Bulbargence Subject: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 08:00:44 +0200 Roy, Allthough I am in a much milder climat (we get frost down to -8° 18F) I never put more then 2-3 cm (1") of soil on it. Otherwise the tubesr make a kind of "stem" to get to the surface. If any doubt put a good layer of mulch, compost etc on it I agree with John that C pseudibericum is a hardy and and most recommendable species. I grow it here like C hederifolium, but a dark pink mid winter flowering Greetings Lauw de Jager http://www.bulbargence.com South of France (zone 8 Olivier) Coord. Geogr.(GPS): 43°42' 43" N 4° 32' 12" E > C. pseudibericum grows well outside here and is seeding around > gently in the garden, so is certainly worth a try outside. From dejager@bulbargence.com Fri Sep 21 02:08:09 2007 Message-Id: From: Bulbargence Subject: Amsterdam bulbing Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 08:08:00 +0200 Lee, I recommend you to go to the Aalsmeer flower market (a very early morning visit, well organised for tourists), nobody of your group will be disappointed. For more specialised visits go to Lisse and see the HOBAHO or CNB bulbtrade center, there are always displays of flowers and of course million of bulbs (especially on a Monday). Just check out on the Keukenhof, Lisse, they have now often something going on there out of the spring season Greetings Lauw de Jager http://www.bulbargence.com South of France (zone 8 Olivier) Coord. Geogr.(GPS): 43°42' 43" N 4° 32' 12" E I know it's the wrong season to see all the wonderful flower displays, > but next week I'll be in Amsterdam on business and was wondering if > there is anything at this time of the year bulb or plant related that > might be worth seeing (and possibly dragging non-plantophile co-workers > along to see)? Or even non-plant-related things that would be worth > going to see when we're not otherwise occupied with work? From rherold@yahoo.com Fri Sep 21 11:03:37 2007 Message-Id: <472058.83515.qm@web62413.mail.re1.yahoo.com> From: Roy Herold Subject: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 08:03:32 -0700 (PDT) Lauw, In my experience I have never seen C. hederifolium form any sort of trunk or stem as you describe. I have always seen the flower and leaf stems go out horizontally for some distance before heading for the surface. In pots, I always get a ring of leaves and flowers around the the edge. In the ground, the effect is like a wreath, with a hole in the middle. Later season leaves sometimes fill this in a bit. On the other hand, C. graecum is one of the types that grows up, not out. In this species, formation of a trunk is to be expected. I have some elderly tubers, nearly 20 years old, with trunks close to three inches long. The root structure on graecum is radically different from hederifolum, with big, thick, possibly contractile roots only on the bottom of the tuber. My biggest difficulty in growing them is to find a pot that is deep enough to handle the tuber (~4" diameter), the floral trunks as described, and six inch long roots that resemble pencils. Usually the roots wind up getting folded over. I recall an article in the Cyclamen Journal that described graecums found in nature with trunks over ten inches long. All perfectly normal! --Roy NW of Boston ----- Original Message ---- Roy, Allthough I am in a much milder climat (we get frost down to -8° 18F) I never put more then 2-3 cm (1") of soil on it. Otherwise the tubesr make a kind of "stem" to get to the surface. If any doubt put a good layer of mulch, compost etc on it From darrensage100@hotmail.com Fri Sep 21 11:47:23 2007 Message-Id: From: Darren Sage Subject: Amsterdam bulbing Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 15:47:22 +0000 Hi Lee I am from the UK, although I now live in Mexico, and they have an early autumn it seems over there. So I expect you are going to see autumn flowering bulbs like various autumn crocuses and nerines. Not sure if there are any shows though. We will need our dutch friends to answer that one. I will copy this to some of mine. Darren > To: pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> From: wpoulsen@pacbell.net> Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 13:33:54 -0700> Subject: [pbs] Amsterdam bulbing> > I know it's the wrong season to see all the wonderful flower displays, > but next week I'll be in Amsterdam on business and was wondering if > there is anything at this time of the year bulb or plant related that > might be worth seeing (and possibly dragging non-plantophile co-workers > along to see)? Or even non-plant-related things that would be worth > going to see when we're not otherwise occupied with work?> > Thanks for any suggestions.> --Lee Poulsen> Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a> > _______________________________________________> pbs mailing list> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki _________________________________________________________________ Celeb spotting – Play CelebMashup and win cool prizes https://www.celebmashup.com From janemcgary@earthlink.net Fri Sep 21 12:12:16 2007 Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.0.20070921090957.016d4650@mail.earthlink.net> From: Jane McGary Subject: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 09:16:27 -0700 Roy wrote, " C. graecum is one of the types that grows up, not out. In this species, formation of a trunk is to be expected. My biggest difficulty in growing them is to find a pot that is deep enough to handle the tuber..." I grow most of my C. graecum now in plastic mesh pots plunged in sand, and so I can plant them deeply and they still have as much run for their annual roots as they want, extending them out through the mesh. I use soluble fertilizer with a hose hook-up, so the plunge sand has some nutrition for them, in addition to the fines naturally in it. I have just one C. graecum in the garden, in a sloping scree situation, and it's going into its third year in the open; it was pretty big when I planted it, though. Cyclamen mirabile has also returned in the open this year; I had some extras rescued from among the pots, where ants sow the seeds that I don't get to first. Regarding Cyclamen hederifolium and moisture, there's a path between two of my bulb frames that is regularly under an inch of water in winter. C. hederifolium has appeared there and has flowered for some years now. Yet I've also seen it in the wild growing as a chasmophyte (cliff-dweller) in crevices on a vertical rock face. In gardens in this area it often appears in lawns that aren't mown in winter. When people ask me what to plant in "impossible" places, such as the base of an old hedge, I recommend this species, with the caveat that it disappears in summer. Jane McGary Northwestern Oregon, USA From hornig@usadatanet.net Fri Sep 21 14:32:10 2007 Message-Id: <209AB883CF5F46BA9480DF61A5F15A48@ellenPC> From: "Ellen Hornig" Subject: Cyclamen graecum (was C. hederifolium) Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 14:31:54 -0400 Much to my surprise, several C. graecum have now made it through 2 winters in my mound garden, which consists of nothing more than the clayey loam we excavated in order to put in a small brick patio and piled up next to said patio in a gentle mound. I had a lot of extra C. graecum at the time, so I planted them out with a liberal hand (and no thought to numbers, so I can't say what percentage persist). However, they have not only persisted, but some have bloomed (a little), and there are definitely more leaves there this year than last. I would have to assume that our superlative snow cover explains this uccess -above the snow, we go down to 0 to -10F, occasionally lower... Ellen Ellen Hornig Seneca Hill Perennials 3712 County Route 57 Oswego NY 13126 USA www.senecahillperennials.com From john@johnlonsdale.net Fri Sep 21 15:03:02 2007 Message-Id: <018701c7fc81$e6cbb8c0$6801a8c0@XPS400> From: "John T Lonsdale" Subject: Cyclamen graecum (was C. hederifolium) Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 15:02:04 -0400 I think Ellen is right about the snow cover protecting C. graecum. I had a few volunteers outside here for about 3 years. I eventually saw a single flower but they went away completely as soon as we had a really cold spell without snow cover. J. John T Lonsdale PhD 407 Edgewood Drive, Exton, Pennsylvania 19341, USA Home: 610 594 9232 Cell: 484 678 9856 Fax: 801 327 1266 Visit "Edgewood" - The Lonsdale Garden at http://www.edgewoodgardens.net USDA Zone 6b From rherold@yahoo.com Fri Sep 21 17:17:45 2007 Message-Id: <730343.71391.qm@web62406.mail.re1.yahoo.com> From: Roy Herold Subject: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 14:17:44 -0700 (PDT) Not to beat a dead horse, but I have a couple of other C. hederifolium stories... Once upon a time, in the early 80s, I had a rabbit that lived for several years in a hutch in the garden until it met an untimely death. The ground beneath the hutch was, to put it mildly, VERY well fertilized. And quite soggy. I have no idea what the nitrogen content was, but it must have been off the scale. I proceeded to purchase what must have been my very first hardy cyclamen, a 'neapolitanum' tuber from a local garden center (probably wild collected, as they tended to be at that time). I planted it right in the middle of the spot previously occupied by the rabbit hutch. The first year I wound up with a plant a foot in diameter, the next year it was three feet in diameter with hundreds upon hundreds of pink flowers. I guess that was what got me hooked on cyclamen. Alas, it perished in a move to a new garden the next year. Moral of the story? Feed your cyclamen, I guess. In my subsequent garden, there was a rock wall, several feet high, built with mortar but with cracks here and there. I had planted some cyclamen seedlings in the gravel at its base. The next think I knew, cyclamen seedlings started to appear in the cracks, a couple of feet off the ground (love those ants!). I figured they would die in short order, but a couple persisted. It was amazing to see big leaves and flowers emerging from a quarter inch wide crack every year. I always wondered what shape the tuber must have taken on to adapt to the niche between the rocks. My best C. purparascens to date showed up this year, planted by the ants in rocks near its parent. One of the plain green 'fatrense' types, it had leaves that were nearly three inches in diameter. I was amazed. It thrived in our summer drought, out of the reach of the sprinklers. --Roy NW of Boston From arnold@nj.rr.com Fri Sep 21 17:21:00 2007 Message-Id: <46F435AB.7020502@nj.rr.com> From: Arnold Trachtenberg Subject: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 17:20:43 -0400 Roy: I guess the other moral to the story is keep an eye on your rabbits! Arnold P.S. I'd like a couple of squirrels to meet the same untimely death. From robertwerra@pacific.net Sat Sep 22 00:53:16 2007 Message-Id: <001001c7fcd4$b9200c20$ba296ad0@popbob> From: robertwerra@pacific.net Subject: Free moraea corms Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 21:54:56 -0700 To all, I fell in love with winter growing moraeas 19 years ago, first with the peacock moreas, then with the fugacious ones which I love even more.I have been faithful, well pretty faithful except with some dalliance with gladiolas, daubenyas, calochorti and a few other charmers. I grow 30+ moraeas. However, I am 76 yrs. old and it is time to pass some moraeas on to younger, equally passionate and faithful moraea lovers, preferably in a warm to hot mediteranean climate in the U.S. If there are any out there, please let me know privately on my Email. I will be gone for 2 weeks. It is not too late to plant them. I will have seed and some other material for our regular PBS exchange later. Bob Werra in inland No. Calif. From paige@hillkeep.ca Sat Sep 22 01:21:56 2007 Message-Id: From: "Pacific Rim" Subject: Free moraea corms Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 22:21:37 -0700 Hello, Bob. May I first urge you to share as many of your treasures as possible with Diana Chapman. You surely know her. I am a grower of special bulbs but I am in rainy zone 6 in BC, north of you, and would have to shelter your Moraea in a greenhouse, at least till I got a sense of how to adjust their drainage. For what it's worth, I grow many Calochortus outdoors, in the rain, in sand. I shelter them only when they are about to bloom, because their floral tissues are so easily damaged, as are those of Crocus, Colchicum and the like. I can think of a number of private collectors who will speak up. Perhaps you will favor them. Nonetheless, after Diana, despite my different climate I am a reasonable candidate to receive starts of your plants because I have a good record of conserving stocks, whether or not I sell them. So many growers drop a stock when it can't earn its keep. I have all kinds of refugees in my beds, garden, greenhouse. Many have been dropped by the people I got them from. :-)) You can see my website at www.hillkeep.ca . I am just north of the border with WA. This year we are basically not selling, just growing and planting because my father is not well. My mother is 80, he is 90. I am 59 and have at least a couple of decades of feisty growing ahead of me. With best wishes, Paige Woodward paige@hillkeep.ca www.hillkeep.ca ---- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: "Robert J Werra" Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 9:54 PM Subject: [pbs] Free moraea corms > To all, I fell in love with winter growing moraeas 19 years ago, first > with the peacock moreas, then with the fugacious ones which I love even > more.I have been faithful, well pretty faithful except with some dalliance > with gladiolas, daubenyas, calochorti and a few other charmers. I grow 30+ > moraeas. However, I am 76 yrs. old and it is time to pass some moraeas on > to younger, equally passionate and faithful moraea lovers, preferably in a > warm to hot mediteranean climate in the U.S. If there are any out there, > please let me know privately on my Email. I will be gone for 2 weeks. It > is not too late to plant them. I will have seed and some other material > for our regular PBS exchange later. Bob Werra in inland No. Calif. > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From paige@hillkeep.ca Sat Sep 22 01:27:59 2007 Message-Id: From: "Pacific Rim" Subject: Moraea: apology Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 22:27:31 -0700 Dear all: Please forgive my private note, unwittingly copied to the entire list. Paige Woodward > Hello, Bob. > > May I first urge you to share as many of your treasures as possible with > Diana Chapman. You surely know her. From jonathan@terraviva.agr.br Sat Sep 22 07:17:27 2007 Message-Id: <62SWWTg0rJrH.04BJWlcl@smtp.mail.yahoo.com.br> From: "Jonathan" Subject: pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 21 Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2007 08:17:33 -0300 -- mens. original -- Assunto: pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 21 De: pbs-request@lists.ibiblio.org Data: 21/09/2007 15:47 Send pbs mailing list submissions to pbs@lists.ibiblio.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to pbs-request@lists.ibiblio.org You can reach the person managing the list at pbs-owner@lists.ibiblio.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of pbs digest..." List-Post:<mailto:pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> List-Archive:<http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/pbslist> Today's Topics: 1. Re: what is the opposite of contractile? (totototo@telus.net) 2. Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth (Jonathan Knisely) 3. Re: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth (John T Lonsdale) 4. Re: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth (Roy Herold) 5. Re: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth (John T Lonsdale) 6. South American Bulbs (Diana Chapman) 7. Re: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth (aaron floden) 8. Amsterdam bulbing (Lee Poulsen) 9. Re: Amsterdam bulbing (Arnold Trachtenberg) 10. Pacific BX 153 CLOSED (Dell Sherk) 11. Re: Amsterdam bulbing (John Grimshaw) 12. Re: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth (Bulbargence) 13. Re: Amsterdam bulbing (Bulbargence) 14. Re: Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth (Roy Herold) 15. Re: Amsterdam bulbing (Darren Sage) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 09:12:32 -0700 From: totototo@telus.net Subject: Re: [pbs] what is the opposite of contractile? To: pbs@lists.ibiblio.org Message-ID: <20070920161249.95MRQP9L30@priv-edmwaa05.telusplanet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII On 19 Sep 07, at 9:46, Max Withers wrote: > There is an interesting discussion on the mediterranean plants list > about bulbs that that seem to push themselves out of the soil, > occasioned by Drimia (Urginea) maritima: > > http://www.hort.net/lists/medit-plants/sep07/subject.html > > Anyone have any theories about why some bulbs do this (some of the S. > African Amaryllids also come to mind)? Someone pointed out that just > because a plant can do something does not necessarily mean there is an > adaptive reason to do it. You don't have to go that far to find an example. Galanthus nivalis often pushes bulbs to the surface, and I've even seen Narcissus cultivars do the same. The physical mechanism seems to be overly exuberant production of offsets until crowding forces some onto the surface. The adaptive value is that doing so facilitates asexual reproduction. Commercial bulbs of /Iris danfordiae/ are notorious for breaking up into "rice grains" unless planted very deeply. My guess is that this too is a strategy for facilitating asexual reproduction when the bulbs are near the soil surface. -- RFW "It's MY computer, Mr Gates. Stop trying to tell me what it will/won't do." ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 12:50:08 -0500 From: Jonathan Knisely Subject: [pbs] Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth To: pbs@lists.ibiblio.org Message-ID: <46F2B2D0.7010907@yale.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=ISO-8859-1 I have tubers I grew from seed of C. hederifolium and I'm wondering about the appropriate depth to plant them outside in where I hope they will naturalize and thrive. I have had tubers of C. hederifolium and C. Coum that froze to mush during the past winter's cold snaps in my USDA 6a climate. These sadly departed geophytes were planted with the top of the tuber barely covered, and were located in a bed of Meehania cordata, with evergreen branches strewn atop the bed to improve their chances of surviving winter cold. The tubers range in size from about 7-15 mm in diameter. I fear that if I plant them too deeply, there will be problems with emergence of foliage (and flowers) that will result in the demise of the tuber. Can anyone provide practical recommendations that will help me as I'm crouching in my border? Jonathan Knisely New Haven, CT ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:13:51 -0400 From: "John T Lonsdale" Subject: Re: [pbs] Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth To: "'Pacific Bulb Society'" Message-ID: <00f901c7fbb2$0016c070$6801a8c0@XPS400> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, I'm a little surprised to hear that neither coum nor hederifolium survived last winter. You are colder than us here in SE Pennsylvania, but not so much more that I'd expect that to happen. Cold hardiness is very much influenced by drainage - was the ground these tubers were in at all soggy? Freezing and thawing in less than perfectly well-drained ground could cause you to lose plants that would be hardy with perfect drainage in a garden a zone colder. On our S facing perfectly drained hillside I have a number of hederifolium that are 25-50% exposed to the air - they look like flying saucers that have crashed into the slope and stuck half-way in. They are up to 8" diameter - but they come through the winters just fine. I'd try to optimize the situation and drainage - and then you can certainly plant deeper as well if you want, as long as whatever is on top drains perfectly then the flowers and leaves will find a way through. You could put up to 6" of pure gravel on top of them without issue - but don't create a sump for water to gather on top of the tubers. Good luck! J. John T Lonsdale PhD 407 Edgewood Drive, Exton, Pennsylvania 19341, USA Home: 610 594 9232 Cell: 484 678 9856 Fax: 801 327 1266 Visit "Edgewood" - The Lonsdale Garden at http://www.edgewoodgardens.net USDA Zone 6b ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 11:28:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Roy Herold Subject: Re: [pbs] Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth To: Pacific Bulb Society Message-ID: <775569.19646.qm@web62409.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Jonathan, In my own Zone 5B/6A garden , I plant them with the tops of the tubers a couple of inches deep. More is okay, less is bad. Hederifolium puts out roots from the top and sides of the tuber, unlike coum and the like which have roots on the bottom surface only. Don't worry, the foliage and flowers will make it up through most anything. I've rescued tubers from seeds that germinated six inches deep in a pot, and tiny filament-like leaves somehow make it to the surface. I have planted Cyclamen hederifolum all over my garden, and they appear to be happy in some spots, and a disaster in others. The best locations seem to be on a north facing slope under a japanese maple, and on top of the septic tank (a little extra warmth?). The ants seem to find good locations, too, and volunteers are thriving in some very unlikely spots. In addition to hed, coum, cilicium, and purparascens seem to be the best for naturalizing in this way, and love coarse gravel as a seed bed. It always pains me to run the lawnmower over the coums in the lawn, but the ants drag them out there, too. One final tip is to try to find a spot that doesn't get any direct sun in the winter. Sunlight makes the normal freeze/thaw cycles in NE even worse. Good luck with your planting. My own goal is to get pseudibericum going outside one of these days. It was happy in an unheated cold frame last winter, so should be worth a try. --Roy NW of Boston Snow cover? Hah! Unreliable at best... C. rohlfsianum just coming into bloom... ----- Original Message ---- From: Jonathan Knisely To: pbs@lists.ibiblio.org Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2007 1:50:08 PM Subject: [pbs] Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth I have tubers I grew from seed of C. hederifolium and I'm wondering about the appropriate depth to plant them outside in where I hope they will naturalize and thrive. I have had tubers of C. hederifolium and C. Coum that froze to mush during the past winter's cold snaps in my USDA 6a climate. These sadly departed geophytes were planted with the top of the tuber barely covered, and were located in a bed of Meehania cordata, with evergreen branches strewn atop the bed to improve their chances of surviving winter cold. The tubers range in size from about 7-15 mm in diameter. I fear that if I plant them too deeply, there will be problems with emergence of foliage (and flowers) that will result in the demise of the tuber. Can anyone provide practical recommendations that will help me as I'm crouching in my border? Jonathan Knisely New Haven, CT _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:33:11 -0400 From: "John T Lonsdale" Subject: Re: [pbs] Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth To: "'Pacific Bulb Society'" Message-ID: <00fa01c7fbb4$b37df550$6801a8c0@XPS400> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Roy, Just FYI - C. pseudibericum grows well outside here and is seeding around gently in the garden, so is certainly worth a try outside. Best, John John T Lonsdale PhD 407 Edgewood Drive, Exton, Pennsylvania 19341, USA Home: 610 594 9232 Cell: 484 678 9856 Fax: 801 327 1266 Visit "Edgewood" - The Lonsdale Garden at http://www.edgewoodgardens.net USDA Zone 6b ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 12:02:45 -0700 From: "Diana Chapman" Subject: [pbs] South American Bulbs To: "Pacific Bulb Society" Message-ID: <001401c7fbb8$d4b73840$ed396f4b@DJ9SK221> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Dear All: For those within reach of the San Francisco Bay Area, I will be giving a presentation on November 19, 2007, entitled "Treasures of the Andes: Bulbs of South America" cosponsored by the San Francisco Botanical Garden Society and the California Horticultural Society. The time is 7:45pm, place is San Francisco County Fair Building (Hall of Flowers), 9th Avenue & Lincoln way, San Francisco, CA. The talk is preceded by a stroll around Strybing Arboretum and Botanical Gardens at 4:00pm, then dinner at a nearby restaurant. You don't have to be a member to attend. I will be taking a selection of bulbs for sale at prices reduced from the catalogue, and, hopefully, some that are not presently listed. There is a drawing, to which I am contributing a small Pamianthe peruviana. I hope some members can make it to the meeting. The walk around the Arboretum and the dinner gives everyone an opportunity to meet. Diana Telos Rare Bulbs ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 12:18:00 -0700 (PDT) From: aaron floden Subject: Re: [pbs] Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth To: Pacific Bulb Society Message-ID: <105120.40590.qm@web34310.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hello, I had C.pseudibericum winter in Kansas for three years. It started as a single seedling from the Archibalds highest altitude collection after I dumped the two year old un-germinated pot. The tuber was quarter-sized after 3 years and is now planted in the garden here in TN. Purpurascens was by far the best in Kansas, and seems content here so far also. Hederifolium was always iffy in Kansas living about 2 years on average. Coum I got to bloom once, but always died in early spring or summer. Aaron Floden Knoxville, TN --- John T Lonsdale wrote: > Just FYI - C. pseudibericum grows well outside here > and is seeding around > gently in the garden, so is certainly worth a try > outside. > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Check out the hottest 2008 models today at Yahoo! Autos. http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 13:33:54 -0700 From: Lee Poulsen Subject: [pbs] Amsterdam bulbing To: PBS Society Message-ID: <9f5cb79dc3c98101a99aea484c6804f3@pacbell.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed I know it's the wrong season to see all the wonderful flower displays, but next week I'll be in Amsterdam on business and was wondering if there is anything at this time of the year bulb or plant related that might be worth seeing (and possibly dragging non-plantophile co-workers along to see)? Or even non-plant-related things that would be worth going to see when we're not otherwise occupied with work? Thanks for any suggestions. --Lee Poulsen Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:11:02 -0400 From: Arnold Trachtenberg Subject: Re: [pbs] Amsterdam bulbing To: Pacific Bulb Society Message-ID: <46F2E1E6.8050807@nj.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Lee: Your forgetting the possible displays of fall blooming bulbs like Crocus and Colchicums. Arnold ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:14:14 -0400 From: "Dell Sherk" Subject: [pbs] Pacific BX 153 CLOSED To: "'Adam Fikso'" , "'c'" , "'Macfarlane'" , "'Mark'" , "'Mark Wilcox'" , "Pat Colville" , "PBS list" , "The Masterson Family" Message-ID: <20070920211427.DB4AB4C01D@lists.ibiblio.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear All, Everything is claimed in this lot. Packages should go out after the weekend. Enjoy, Dell Dell Sherk, Director, PBS BX ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 06:42:36 +0100 From: "John Grimshaw" Subject: Re: [pbs] Amsterdam bulbing To: "Pacific Bulb Society" Message-ID: <001901c7fc12$37ed2dd0$0201a8c0@John> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Lee - there are all sorts of things to look at in Amsterdam... some of them are very bulbous. Much depends on how long you have for exploring. If you could get to the flower auction in Aalsmeer that would be an interesting experience. Funnily enough I never went to an actual auction while I lived in Holland, but used to love visiting the wholesale florists and plant-sellers who occupy part of the cavernous auction building - see http://www.cultra.nl/. There you get a concentrated experience of the Dutch horticultural industry as they sell something of everything that passes through the auction to smaller traders/florists etc who don't need 10,000 roses all at once. You can just walk in and prowl about but you need an account to buy anything. What they offer of course depends on season but is always amazing. I once was able to buy bunches (50 in each) of Oncocyclus irises, imported from Israel. In Amsterdam itself the floating flower market is interesting, even if touristy, & there are a couple of bulb sellers. To those accustomed to the dullness of an English or American florist's offerings a visit to even a local Dutch florist's shop is a revelation. For a non plant-related activity Amsterdam is of course full of cultural interest, which could be combined with a horticultural theme. You could go to the Rijksmuseum to study flowers in old flower pieces - not to mention the Rembrandts etc. There are some surprising plant images in the Van Gogh Museum too. For food I would recommend an Indonesian meal - the Dutch East Indies connection is quite strong. I used to go to Sampurna, an Indonesian restaurant (www.sampurna.com) by the flower market and have a rijsttafel - a selection of all sorts of small dishes of delicious things. Let us know how you get on! John Grimshaw Dr John M. Grimshaw Sycamore Cottage Colesbourne Nr Cheltenham Gloucestershire GL53 9NP ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 08:00:44 +0200 From: Bulbargence Subject: Re: [pbs] Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth To: Pacific Bulb Society Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Roy, Allthough I am in a much milder climat (we get frost down to -8? 18F) I never put more then 2-3 cm (1") of soil on it. Otherwise the tubesr make a kind of "stem" to get to the surface. If any doubt put a good layer of mulch, compost etc on it I agree with John that C pseudibericum is a hardy and and most recommendable species. I grow it here like C hederifolium, but a dark pink mid winter flowering Greetings Lauw de Jager http://www.bulbargence.com South of France (zone 8 Olivier) Coord. Geogr.(GPS): 43?42' 43" N 4? 32' 12" E > C. pseudibericum grows well outside here and is seeding around > gently in the garden, so is certainly worth a try outside. ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 08:08:00 +0200 From: Bulbargence Subject: Re: [pbs] Amsterdam bulbing To: Pacific Bulb Society Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Lee, I recommend you to go to the Aalsmeer flower market (a very early morning visit, well organised for tourists), nobody of your group will be disappointed. For more specialised visits go to Lisse and see the HOBAHO or CNB bulbtrade center, there are always displays of flowers and of course million of bulbs (especially on a Monday). Just check out on the Keukenhof, Lisse, they have now often something going on there out of the spring season Greetings Lauw de Jager http://www.bulbargence.com South of France (zone 8 Olivier) Coord. Geogr.(GPS): 43?42' 43" N 4? 32' 12" E I know it's the wrong season to see all the wonderful flower displays, > but next week I'll be in Amsterdam on business and was wondering if > there is anything at this time of the year bulb or plant related that > might be worth seeing (and possibly dragging non-plantophile co-workers > along to see)? Or even non-plant-related things that would be worth > going to see when we're not otherwise occupied with work? ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 08:03:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Roy Herold Subject: Re: [pbs] Cyclamen hederifolium planting depth To: Pacific Bulb Society Message-ID: <472058.83515.qm@web62413.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Lauw, In my experience I have never seen C. hederifolium form any sort of trunk or stem as you describe. I have always seen the flower and leaf stems go out horizontally for some distance before heading for the surface. In pots, I always get a ring of leaves and flowers around the the edge. In the ground, the effect is like a wreath, with a hole in the middle. Later season leaves sometimes fill this in a bit. On the other hand, C. graecum is one of the types that grows up, not out. In this species, formation of a trunk is to be expected. I have some elderly tubers, nearly 20 years old, with trunks close to three inches long. The root structure on graecum is radically different from hederifolum, with big, thick, possibly contractile roots only on the bottom of the tuber. My biggest difficulty in growing them is to find a pot that is deep enough to handle the tuber (~4" diameter), the floral trunks as described, and six inch long roots that resemble pencils. Usually the roots wind up getting folded over. I recall an article in the Cyclamen Journal that described graecums found in nature with trunks over ten inches long. All perfectly normal! --Roy NW of Boston ----- Original Message ---- Roy, Allthough I am in a much milder climat (we get frost down to -8? 18F) I never put more then 2-3 cm (1") of soil on it. Otherwise the tubesr make a kind of "stem" to get to the surface. If any doubt put a good layer of mulch, compost etc on it ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 15:47:22 +0000 From: Darren Sage Subject: Re: [pbs] Amsterdam bulbing To: Pacific Bulb Society Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Hi Lee I am from the UK, although I now live in Mexico, and they have an early autumn it seems over there. So I expect you are going to see autumn flowering bulbs like various autumn crocuses and nerines. Not sure if there are any shows though. We will need our dutch friends to answer that one. I will copy this to some of mine. Darren > To: pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> From: wpoulsen@pacbell.net> Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 13:33:54 -0700> Subject: [pbs] Amsterdam bulbing> > I know it's the wrong season to see all the wonderful flower displays, > but next week I'll be in Amsterdam on business and was wondering if > there is anything at this time of the year bulb or plant related that > might be worth seeing (and possibly dragging non-plantophile co-workers > along to see)? Or even non-plant-related things that would be worth > going to see when we're not otherwise occupied with work?> > Thanks for any suggestions.> --Lee Poulsen> Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a> > _______________________________________________> pbs mailing list> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki _________________________________________________________________ Celeb spotting ? Play CelebMashup and win cool prizes https://www.celebmashup.com ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php End of pbs Digest, Vol 56, Issue 21 *********************************** From adam14113@ameritech.net Sat Sep 22 12:18:01 2007 Message-Id: <00d901c7fd34$8e22cac0$aa686040$@net> From: "Adam Fikso" Subject: opposite of contractile Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2007 11:20:55 -0500 Extensile comes up as I think of it. Checked as OK in my big Merriam-Webster. Capable of being extended. From pcamusa@hotmail.com Sat Sep 22 18:28:11 2007 Message-Id: From: "P. C. Andrews" Subject: what is the opposite of contractile? Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2007 18:28:10 -0400 > Possibly bulbs that "push" themselves out of the soil evolved in situations > of highly mobile soils, such as dunes or repeatedly flooded zones, and this > strategy keeps the bulb at an optimal level where it will not be buried too > deeply and have to expend too much stored energy extending its leaves and > scape to the increasingly distant surface. I have a couple of interesting photos that nicely illustrate the adaptation of Hymenocallis to growing on dunes. I can't post to the PBS wiki yet but would be glad to send copies to anyone interested. Regards, Phil Andrews _________________________________________________________________ Can you find the hidden words?  Take a break and play Seekadoo! http://club.live.com/seekadoo.aspx?icid=seek_wlmailtextlink From darrensage100@hotmail.com Mon Sep 24 09:02:22 2007 Message-Id: From: Darren Sage Subject: FW: Amsterdam bulbing Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2007 13:02:20 +0000 Subject: RE: [pbs] Amsterdam bulbingDate: Mon, 24 Sep 2007 09:27:45 +0200From: Henk.Gude@wur.nlTo: darrensage100@hotmail.com Hi Darren (Lee), I am afraid there it not much to see at the moment. A few fields with Dahlia, Gladiolus and some Begonia, but very spred over the country. If your friend works in horticulture there is a big trade show from October 9 to 12. Otherwise I recommend the usual interesting stuff in Amsterdam: coffee shops, musea, canal tours etc. Bye, Henk Van: Darren Sage [mailto:darrensage100@hotmail.com] Verzonden: vrijdag 21 september 2007 17:47Aan: Pacific Bulb SocietyOnderwerp: RE: [pbs] Amsterdam bulbing Hi Lee I am from the UK, although I now live in Mexico, and they have an early autumn it seems over there. So I expect you are going to see autumn flowering bulbs like various autumn crocuses and nerines. Not sure if there are any shows though. We will need our dutch friends to answer that one. I will copy this to some of mine. Darren > To: pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> From: wpoulsen@pacbell.net> Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 13:33:54 -0700> Subject: [pbs] Amsterdam bulbing> > I know it's the wrong season to see all the wonderful flower displays, > but next week I'll be in Amsterdam on business and was wondering if > there is anything at this time of the year bulb or plant related that > might be worth seeing (and possibly dragging non-plantophile co-workers > along to see)? Or even non-plant-related things that would be worth > going to see when we're not otherwise occupied with work?> > Thanks for any suggestions.> --Lee Poulsen> Pasadena, California, USDA Zone 10a> > _______________________________________________> pbs mailing list> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki Get free emoticon packs and customisation from Windows Live. Pimp My Live! _________________________________________________________________ Celeb spotting – Play CelebMashup and win cool prizes https://www.celebmashup.com From dells@voicenet.com Tue Sep 25 17:03:15 2007 Message-Id: <20070925210310.672094C01B@lists.ibiblio.org> From: "Dell Sherk" Subject: Pacific BX 154 Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2007 17:02:51 -0400 Dear All, The items listed below have been donated by our members to be shared. If you are interested in obtaining some of them, please email me PRIVATELY at . Include "BX 154" in the subject line. Specify the NUMBERS of the items which you would like; do not specify quantities. It is a good idea to include your snail mail address, too, in case I don't already have it. Availability is based on a first come, first served system. When you receive your seeds/bulbs you will find, included with them, a statement of how much money (usually $2.00/item) (cash, check, or Pay Pal to ; no money orders, please) you should send the PBS treasurer to defray our costs for packing and first-class, priority-mail, or international postage. PLEASE NOTE: NEW POSTAL-RATE SCHEMES NECESSITATE OUR PLACING A SURCHARGE ON EACH ORDER FROM PBS BX OFFERINGS. Some of you are members of the online PBS discussion forum but are not members of the Pacific Bulb Society. THIS BX OFFERING IS AVAILABLE ONLY TO MEMBERS OF THE PBS. Consider joining the PBS so that you can take advantage of future offers such as this. Go to our website: .... If you would like to donate seeds or bulbs/corms to the PBS,(Donors will receive credit on the BX for the cost of postage for their donations.), please send CLEAN, clearly labeled material to: Dell Sherk 6832 Phillips Mill Rd. New Hope, PA, 18938 USA I WILL REPLY TO YOU WITHIN 24 HRS OF MY RECEIPT OF YOUR ORDER. IF YOU DO NOT HEAR FROM ME, TRY AGAIN !! From Mary Sue Ittner: BULBS (all winter growing unless noted otherwise): 1. Babiana sp. -- grown from seed many years ago and I've never tried to key them, consider them hybrids. There are a number of these and they are either pink or purple (from a mixed batch). Good for growing in the ground in climates like California, winter growing 2. Babiana villosa -- don't know if red or pink, winter growing 3. Dichelostemma volubile cormlets -- small cormlets so may take a few years to get to blooming size, this is the twining pink Dichelostemma, winter growing 4. Freesia refracta -- winter growing 5. Freesia leichtlinii -- grown from Gordon Summerfield seed and he's very knowledgeable. It looks like alba to me. I struggled with the key in the Color Encyclopedia and still think it may be alba, winter growing. 6. Gladiolus aurantiacus -- summer growing, not really happy in my climate so am passing it on 7. Ipheion uniflorum white -- winter growing 8. Lachenalia liliflora -- I think, late blooming one and I lost the tag in storage -- winter growing 9. Moraea lurida -- I've never had any bloom that were not yellow with darker markings, no lurid ones 10. Oxalis brasilensis 11. Oxalis incarnata 12. Oxalis luteola MV 5567 -- just a few, one of my favorites, pale yellow, very reliable in my climate 13. Oxalis obtusa peach 14. Oxalis obtusa pink 15. Spiloxene capensis -- probably white, but could be pink 16. Trieleia laxa 'Queen Fabiola' cormlets 17. Triteleia peduncularis cormlets SEED: 18. Brodiaea californica (pink I think), winter growing 19. Cyrtanthus epiphyticus -- summer growing, product of a previous BX 20. Geissorhiza heterostyla -- winter growing 21. Gladiolus miniatus -- love this salmon-orange little Glad, winter growing 22. Nerine krigei -- summer growing and blooming 23. Tritonia securigera -- winter growing Thank you, Mary Sue !! Best wishes, Dell Dell Sherk, Director, PBS BX From rdjenkins@bellsouth.net Thu Sep 27 17:47:51 2007 Message-Id: <001b01c80150$09af6440$6101a8c0@JenkinsMachine> From: "rdjenkins" Subject: 24-8-16= Success. Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 17:47:35 -0400 Thank-you PBS-list in general, but specifically Lee Poulsen and others who discussed fertilizer formulations in the list. I don't know if this is the post that started it all for me, but it is one: http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/pbslist/old.php/2003-October/015564.html . Since I don't mix my own fertilizer, I found a famous-name commercial formulation (with minors) that was close to the original 21-5-12. I switched to it exclusively this spring and generally used a weak solution one very heaping scoop from the small end of the provided spoon) with every watering (except when I was rushed, then it was pure H2O.) I swear by this formula now and until I get some 21-5-12 with minors. I have never seen such phenomenal growth before. More leaves formed than when using 15-30-15 or 20-20-20. Even the attached offsets have as many leaves as the motherbulb and not one bulb has lost any girth. All have flourished and exceeding previous growth patterns using other fertilizers. I just didn't believe it when I read that some large-flowered type could produce as many as 14 leaves a season, but I do now. I know when I get more scapes and multiples from large bulbs this year, I will again remember why: I read it here! I guess I'm glad I didn't switch to Alberto's medium mix with crushed granite (etc.) or I might be shouting my joy with way too much use of the exclamation mark. Maybe next season..... Thanks again! Robert. From c-mueller@tamu.edu Thu Sep 27 18:22:32 2007 Message-Id: <46FBE6D9.E5F2.008A.0@ag.tamu.edu> From: "Cynthia Mueller" Subject: 24-8-16= Success. Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 17:21:51 -0500 Robert: Please tell us the name of the commercial fertilizer you favor, and what companies carry it. Thanks, Cynthia Mueller >>> "rdjenkins" 9/27/2007 4:47 PM >>> Thank-you PBS-list in general, but specifically Lee Poulsen and others who discussed fertilizer formulations in the list. I don't know if this is the post that started it all for me, but it is one: http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/pbslist/old.php/2003-October/015564.html . Since I don't mix my own fertilizer, I found a famous-name commercial formulation (with minors) that was close to the original 21-5-12. I switched to it exclusively this spring and generally used a weak solution one very heaping scoop from the small end of the provided spoon) with every watering (except when I was rushed, then it was pure H2O.) I swear by this formula now and until I get some 21-5-12 with minors. I have never seen such phenomenal growth before. More leaves formed than when using 15-30-15 or 20-20-20. Even the attached offsets have as many leaves as the motherbulb and not one bulb has lost any girth. All have flourished and exceeding previous growth patterns using other fertilizers. I just didn't believe it when I read that some large-flowered type could produce as many as 14 leaves a season, but I do now. I know when I get more scapes and multiples from large bulbs this year, I will again remember why: I read it here! I guess I'm glad I didn't switch to Alberto's medium mix with crushed granite (etc.) or I might be shouting my joy with way too much use of the exclamation mark. Maybe next season..... Thanks again! Robert. _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From lmf@beautifulblooms.ab.ca Thu Sep 27 21:20:13 2007 Message-Id: From: "Linda Foulis" Subject: 24-8-16= Success. Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 19:20:59 -0600 Oh my could you imagine then? I'm on my second year of stupendous growth using Alberto's mix and am still amazed at the growth rate. Albuca maxima started November 2006 (from seed) are at least an inch in diameter. The hippeastrums are starting to bloom again. I read that message you referenced and Lee said it was Apex brand. Linda Foulis Okotoks, AB Canada From rdjenkins@bellsouth.net Thu Sep 27 22:26:08 2007 Message-Id: <000b01c80176$9d98e1b0$6101a8c0@JenkinsMachine> From: "rdjenkins" Subject: 24-8-16= Success. Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 22:23:50 -0400 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cynthia Mueller" To: "Pacific Bulb Society" Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 6:21 PM Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success. > Robert: Please tell us the name of the commercial fertilizer you favor, and what companies carry it. Thanks, Cynthia Mueller As Linda F. states, Lee P. was using Apex. I haven't seen that one locally or sought it out but may look into it. I used Miracle-Gro. Easily found in the US. Not sure about elsewhere. Check the 'net. Robert From lamonready@hotmail.com Thu Sep 27 22:47:12 2007 Message-Id: From: lamon ready Subject: pbs] 24-8-16= Success. Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 22:47:11 -0400 hi, i need to find out the minors for the 24-8-16. my local fretilizer co, graco, can custom blend it for me. thanks, lamon > From: rdjenkins@bellsouth.net> To: pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 22:23:50 -0400> Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success.> > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Cynthia Mueller" > To: "Pacific Bulb Society" > Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 6:21 PM> Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success.> > > > Robert: Please tell us the name of the commercial fertilizer you favor, and what companies carry it. Thanks, Cynthia Mueller> > As Linda F. states, Lee P. was using Apex. I haven't seen that one locally or sought it out but may look into it.> > I used Miracle-Gro. Easily found in the US. Not sure about elsewhere. Check the 'net.> > Robert> > _______________________________________________> pbs mailing list> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From rdjenkins@bellsouth.net Thu Sep 27 23:29:36 2007 Message-Id: <003a01c8017f$bbc7b180$6101a8c0@JenkinsMachine> From: "rdjenkins" Subject: 24-8-16= Success. Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 23:29:06 -0400 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Foulis" To: "Pacific Bulb Society" Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 9:20 PM Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success. > Oh my could you imagine then? I'm on my second year of stupendous growth > using Alberto's mix and am still amazed at the growth rate. Albuca maxima > started November 2006 (from seed) are at least an inch in diameter. The > hippeastrums are starting to bloom again. > > I read that message you referenced and Lee said it was Apex brand. > > Linda Foulis > Okotoks, AB Canada You were part of that informative discussion, Linda, and posted about the Alberto's mix, and glad you did. Happy to hear of its benefits for your geos. I mostly grow Hippeastrum and Crinum, and still looking into which cultivars in each group would most likely take to Alberto's mix. What hybrids/species of Hippeastrum are you growing in it? Robert. From perdy@mts.net Thu Sep 27 23:35:32 2007 Message-Id: <484B6D6A974A4620821C52A70E236B1C@DAndersonPC> From: "D Anderson" Subject: 24-8-16= Success. Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 22:35:36 -0500 Linda, I found a comany in Alberta that sells the Apex. Here is the link: http://www.growercentral.com/ :) Donna ----- Original Message ----- From: "rdjenkins" To: ; "Pacific Bulb Society" Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 10:29 PM Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Linda Foulis" > To: "Pacific Bulb Society" > Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 9:20 PM > Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success. > > >> Oh my could you imagine then? I'm on my second year of stupendous growth >> using Alberto's mix and am still amazed at the growth rate. Albuca >> maxima >> started November 2006 (from seed) are at least an inch in diameter. The >> hippeastrums are starting to bloom again. >> >> I read that message you referenced and Lee said it was Apex brand. >> >> Linda Foulis >> Okotoks, AB Canada > > You were part of that informative discussion, Linda, and posted about the > Alberto's mix, and glad you did. > > Happy to hear of its benefits for your geos. I mostly grow Hippeastrum and > Crinum, and still looking into which cultivars in each group would most > likely take to Alberto's mix. > > What hybrids/species of Hippeastrum are you growing in it? > > Robert. > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From rdjenkins@bellsouth.net Thu Sep 27 23:49:48 2007 Message-Id: <004101c80182$8f44dbd0$6101a8c0@JenkinsMachine> From: "rdjenkins" Subject: pbs] 24-8-16= Success. Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 23:48:27 -0400 ----- Original Message ----- From: "lamon ready" To: "Pacific Bulb Society" Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 10:47 PM Subject: [pbs] pbs] 24-8-16= Success. > hi, > i need to find out the minors for the 24-8-16. my local fretilizer co, graco, can custom blend it for me. thanks, lamon > Sent you an email re: you question. The Apex is a solid and the the Miracle-Gro is a soluble, which I prefer to use. Robert. From vickidemetre@earthlink.net Fri Sep 28 04:18:18 2007 Message-Id: From: Vicki Demetre Subject: 24-8-16= Success. Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 01:18:15 -0700 You may want to read this article before you rush to buy Apex, made by the Simplot Company in Idaho. http://www.casperstartribune.net/articles/2007/09/23/news/regional/ 6e913b1e7cba6bf88725735c006c8dbe.txt Vicki D. On Sep 27, 2007, at 8:35 PM, D Anderson wrote: > Linda, I found a comany in Alberta that sells the Apex. Here is > the link: > > http://www.growercentral.com/ > > :) Donna > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "rdjenkins" > To: ; "Pacific Bulb Society" > > Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 10:29 PM > Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success. > > >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Linda Foulis" >> To: "Pacific Bulb Society" >> Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 9:20 PM >> Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success. >> >> >>> Oh my could you imagine then? I'm on my second year of >>> stupendous growth >>> using Alberto's mix and am still amazed at the growth rate. Albuca >>> maxima >>> started November 2006 (from seed) are at least an inch in >>> diameter. The >>> hippeastrums are starting to bloom again. >>> >>> I read that message you referenced and Lee said it was Apex brand. >>> >>> Linda Foulis >>> Okotoks, AB Canada >> >> You were part of that informative discussion, Linda, and posted >> about the >> Alberto's mix, and glad you did. >> >> Happy to hear of its benefits for your geos. I mostly grow >> Hippeastrum and >> Crinum, and still looking into which cultivars in each group would >> most >> likely take to Alberto's mix. >> >> What hybrids/species of Hippeastrum are you growing in it? >> >> Robert. >> _______________________________________________ >> pbs mailing list >> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki >> > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From lmf@beautifulblooms.ab.ca Fri Sep 28 08:32:09 2007 Message-Id: From: "Linda Foulis" Subject: pbs] 24-8-16= Success. Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 06:32:56 -0600 Lamon, go to this page http://agr.wa.gov/pestFert/Fertilizers/FertDB/prodinfo.asp?pname=890 and you'll find the break down of it. Linda Foulis Okotoks, AB Canada i need to find out the minors for the 24-8-16. my local fretilizer co, graco, can custom blend it for me. thanks, lamon From perdy@mts.net Fri Sep 28 12:10:59 2007 Message-Id: <108CA77F98184C6EBA826997257BF27C@DAndersonPC> From: "D Anderson" Subject: 24-8-16= Success. Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 11:10:47 -0500 Thanks, Vicki for showing me the article. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vicki Demetre" To: "Pacific Bulb Society" Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 3:18 AM Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success. > You may want to read this article before you rush to buy Apex, made > by the Simplot Company in Idaho. > > http://www.casperstartribune.net/articles/2007/09/23/news/regional/ > 6e913b1e7cba6bf88725735c006c8dbe.txt > > > > > Vicki D. > > > On Sep 27, 2007, at 8:35 PM, D Anderson wrote: > >> Linda, I found a comany in Alberta that sells the Apex. Here is >> the link: >> >> http://www.growercentral.com/ >> >> :) Donna >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "rdjenkins" >> To: ; "Pacific Bulb Society" >> >> Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 10:29 PM >> Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success. >> >> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Linda Foulis" >>> To: "Pacific Bulb Society" >>> Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 9:20 PM >>> Subject: Re: [pbs] 24-8-16= Success. >>> >>> >>>> Oh my could you imagine then? I'm on my second year of >>>> stupendous growth >>>> using Alberto's mix and am still amazed at the growth rate. Albuca >>>> maxima >>>> started November 2006 (from seed) are at least an inch in >>>> diameter. The >>>> hippeastrums are starting to bloom again. >>>> >>>> I read that message you referenced and Lee said it was Apex brand. >>>> >>>> Linda Foulis >>>> Okotoks, AB Canada >>> >>> You were part of that informative discussion, Linda, and posted >>> about the >>> Alberto's mix, and glad you did. >>> >>> Happy to hear of its benefits for your geos. I mostly grow >>> Hippeastrum and >>> Crinum, and still looking into which cultivars in each group would >>> most >>> likely take to Alberto's mix. >>> >>> What hybrids/species of Hippeastrum are you growing in it? >>> >>> Robert. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> pbs mailing list >>> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >>> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >>> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> pbs mailing list >> pbs@lists.ibiblio.org >> http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From rherold@yahoo.com Fri Sep 28 19:41:59 2007 Message-Id: <46FD9144.4020902@yahoo.com> From: Roy Herold Subject: 24-8-16= Success. Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 19:41:56 -0400 Just for laughs, read this: The Garden Dok knows everything! Perhaps Lee and Robert should take some lessons. :-) From perdy@mts.net Sat Sep 29 16:38:35 2007 Message-Id: From: "D Anderson" Subject: Pink Oxalis Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2007 15:38:34 -0500 Hi, is this normally what you would see? I couldn't believe the size of the bulb. What would happen if I raise the bulb out of the ground? Could it work as a fat plant? http://home-and-garden.webshots.com/photo/2408894840057289329jJrGUO Thanks, Donna in Winnipeg, Manitoba From jimmckenney@jimmckenney.com Sat Sep 29 17:36:37 2007 Message-Id: <000001c802e0$fa9667f0$2f01a8c0@Library> From: "Jim McKenney" Subject: Pink Oxalis Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2007 17:37:46 -0400 Yes, Donna, that's what one would ordinarily see. It's not the bulb; the bulb itself is the round mass on top of the fat, stubby root. In my experience ( I grow this one as a summer plant and store the bulbs dry during the winter) those fat radish like roots shrivel shortly after the bulbs are dug - shortly in this case means within a week or two. After these roots shrivel, the bulbs can be safely stored dry for the winter. Did you know that those fat, juicy roots are a vegetable in Mexico? -----Original Message----- From: pbs-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org [mailto:pbs-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of D Anderson Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2007 4:39 PM To: Pacific Bulb Society Subject: [pbs] Pink Oxalis Hi, is this normally what you would see? I couldn't believe the size of the bulb. What would happen if I raise the bulb out of the ground? Could it work as a fat plant? http://home-and-garden.webshots.com/photo/2408894840057289329jJrGUO Thanks, Donna in Winnipeg, Manitoba _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki From perdy@mts.net Sat Sep 29 18:16:00 2007 Message-Id: <09563D2F702A4DA7AF00F25AAEEC7C7C@DAndersonPC> From: "D Anderson" Subject: Pink Oxalis Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2007 17:15:59 -0500 Thanks, Jim. I kind of figured someone was going to say that they shriveled up...lol! I just have never seen oxalis bulbs like that. :) Donna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim McKenney" To: "'Pacific Bulb Society'" Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2007 4:37 PM Subject: Re: [pbs] Pink Oxalis > Yes, Donna, that's what one would ordinarily see. > > It's not the bulb; the bulb itself is the round mass on top of the fat, > stubby root. > > In my experience ( I grow this one as a summer plant and store the bulbs > dry > during the winter) those fat radish like roots shrivel shortly after the > bulbs are dug - shortly in this case means within a week or two. After > these > roots shrivel, the bulbs can be safely stored dry for the winter. > > Did you know that those fat, juicy roots are a vegetable in Mexico? > > -----Original Message----- > From: pbs-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org [mailto:pbs-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] > On Behalf Of D Anderson > Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2007 4:39 PM > To: Pacific Bulb Society > Subject: [pbs] Pink Oxalis > > Hi, is this normally what you would see? I couldn't believe the size of > the > bulb. What would happen if I raise the bulb out of the ground? Could it > work as a fat plant? > > http://home-and-garden.webshots.com/photo/2408894840057289329jJrGUO > > Thanks, > Donna in Winnipeg, Manitoba > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki > From antennaria@charter.net Sun Sep 30 12:43:51 2007 Message-Id: <20070930124351.7SKZZ.81711.root@fepweb01> From: Subject: bracteoles - good definition needed Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 9:43:51 -0700 I've never fully understood what bracteoles are, particularly when studying the flowers of Alliums. Most species of Allium are listed as either bracteolate (with bracteoles at the base of the pedicels) or ebracteolate (without bracteoles). I've looked closely at such species as Allium thunbergii, described as bracteolate, using a magnifying glass, and dissecting the floral parts, but I can't really detect anything that looks like minute bracts at the juncture of the pedicels with the stem. Maybe they're just so small, or inobvious, that it is difficult to detect. I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be looking for. Can anyone provide a good definition or link to an article that clarifies what floral bracteoles are, with regard to bulbous plants. Thanks, Mark McDonough antennaria@charter.net USDA Zone 5, Massachusetts, USA (New England) ============================== After a hot week (days in the low 90s F), it is finally cooler and more seasonable this weekend. Lots of Allium thunbergii in bud, in several forms. Also, the first floret of an Allium identified as Allium aff. flavidum opened up today... most the buds still a number of days away before they'll open, and after a 45 minute study in the Flora of China Allium keys, believe the plant is actually A. maowenense. From jrc@crellin.org.uk Sun Sep 30 13:01:31 2007 Message-Id: From: "JohnRCrellin" Subject: bracteoles - good definition needed Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 18:01:27 +0100 I'm not sure this helps but the book I refer to for Northern European species in general - Stace - (and which is very highly regarded here by botanists) defines them as "a supplementary or secondary bract" with a diagram that makes it clear you would expect to have a bract at the base of the pedicel before you were likely to have a bracteole further up it... The term bract - or bracteole isn't used in his treatment of the alliums ! (But is, for instance, in the squills. Alliums have spathes or not in that reference as far as I can see.) Like you all this maddens me but I am really a chemist and people tell me they find our jargon maddening ! >> I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be looking for. Yes I often get that feeling with botanical literature. John Crellin From jglatt@hughes.net Sun Sep 30 14:22:00 2007 Message-Id: <46FFE93D.5020301@hughes.net> From: Judy Glattstein Subject: Oca Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 14:21:49 -0400 Just the other week the Wegmans supermarket in Somerville, New Jersey again had oca, priced at $5.99 / pound. It is an oxalis. This year the variety they have for sale is a bright red. Here's a link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oca to the Wikipedia entry. I enjoyed eating them last year, so bout some more this year. Judy in sunny New Jersey where we've gone from too hot to seasonably cool, but sadly lacking in rain From jglatt@hughes.net Sun Sep 30 14:22:26 2007 Message-Id: <46FFE957.50404@hughes.net> From: Judy Glattstein Subject: Oca Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 14:22:15 -0400 Just the other week the Wegmans supermarket in Somerville, New Jersey again had oca, priced at $5.99 / pound. It is an oxalis. This year the variety they have for sale is a bright red. Here's a link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oca to the Wikipedia entry. I enjoyed eating them last year, so bought some more this year. Judy in sunny New Jersey where we've gone from too hot to seasonably cool, but sadly lacking in rain From voltaire@islandnet.com Sun Sep 30 14:34:31 2007 Message-Id: From: Don Jones Subject: bracteoles - good definition needed Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 11:34:04 -0700 Only two of my books define bracteole, as a synonym of bractlet, which is the term all the other books use. Bractlet is defined as 'a very small bract', 'diminutive of bract', 'bract of a pedicel', 'bract born on a secondary axis, as on the pedicel or even on a petiole' None of these is specific to bulbous plants, though. I skimmed through descriptions of some alliums from the Pacific Northwest and saw bracts mentioned in only three species of the thirty described. No bracteoles or bractlets. Diane Whitehead From voltaire@islandnet.com Sun Sep 30 16:02:40 2007 Message-Id: <546FB162-1BB2-4ADF-867E-A34E377C1735@islandnet.com> From: Diane Whitehead Subject: good and bad allium seeds Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 13:02:14 -0700 While I was cleaning my allium seeds I shook the sieve a bit too vigourously and scattered seeds on the table. In picking them up, I gripped one too hard and it disintegrated. It had looked perfectly sound, so I tested more and my fingers pulverized them, too. Maybe the lighter bad seeds had ended up at the top of the sieve, so they were the ones that flew out. I grabbed a pinch of seeds from further down in the sieve, and rubbed them between my fingers. Most remained intact, but not all. I have never done this before, either with seeds I have donated, or seeds I have received or bought. I don't always have good success germinating alliums, and perhaps this may be one reason why. How common is it to have allium seeds that look perfectly sound, but aren't? Is there an easy way to test them? I don't want to rub each seed before I donate it. Would putting them in water so that the bad ones float be a good way? Diane Whitehead Victoria, British Columbia, Canada maritime zone 8, cool Mediterranean climate mild rainy winters, mild dry summers From jegrace@rose.net Sun Sep 30 17:38:03 2007 Message-Id: <1191188276_96731@mail.rose.net> From: "jegrace" Subject: Cardwell Lily Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 17:37:35 -0400 Last year I acquired 3 bulbs for Proiphys (Eurycles) amboinensis (Cardwell lilies) I potted them up, but they never bloomed for me. This year 2 sent up leaves, one did not but appears to be in good shape. 2 rotted. There are not a ton of roots on any of them. I have found very little information on these other than the fact that they require a winter dormancy and shade. I live in hardiness zone 8b (heat zone 9) on the GA/FL border. Winters are short but have occasional hard freezes. Summers are very, very hot. We are officially in drought conditions but have had quite a bit of rain in the last month, and when it rains it rains HARD. I would appreciate any available info on native habitat, how deep to plant, fast/slow draining soil, rich/lean soil, PH requirements, fertilization, etc. Thank you! Erin Grace Thomasville, GA USA From arnold@nj.rr.com Sun Sep 30 18:26:21 2007 Message-Id: <47002278.4050609@nj.rr.com> From: Arnold Trachtenberg Subject: Cardwell Lily Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 18:26:00 -0400 Erin; From Kubitzki: "Leaves annual, petiolate, the laminae broadly reniform or ovate, plicate. Flowers white, erect or slightly nodding, 10-30; perigone funnelform-craterform. Two to three species., Maylasia, Philippines, Australia." Arnold From jshields@indy.net Sun Sep 30 18:59:04 2007 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20070930185017.00b181b0@pop.indy.net> From: "J.E. Shields" Subject: Cardwell Lily Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 18:58:56 -0400 Hi all, Several years ago, I bought 3 bulbs of this species. They have bloomed twice, only a single bulb of the three blooming in any given year. I winter them in a greenhouse, cool but always above freezing, and bone-dry. In summer, they are outside in a lath house and get misted three times a week. I'm not sure how we should be handling them. Each summer, they seem to put out their new leaves later than the previous year. I suspect I may be doing one or more of the following: - Letting them get too cold in winter; maybe a minimum winter (dry season) temperature of 50 F (10 C) or even 60 F (ca 15 C) would be better. They have been experiencing temperatures on very cold winter days down into the upper 30s F (3 to 4 C) - Keeping them too wet in summer. Since they are outside in summer, they get whatever rain we have. This summer, that was not much. - Keeping them too dry in summer. Maybe, in a dry year like this one has been, getting 10 minutes of mist three times a week isn't enough moisture. I'm looking for suggestions too, Erin. They are not self fertile, as I've tried pollinating the occasional bloom in past season. Best wishes, Jim Shields in central Indiana (USA), USDA cold zone 5 At 06:26 PM 9/30/2007 -0400, you wrote: >Erin; > > From Kubitzki: > >"Leaves annual, petiolate, the laminae broadly reniform or ovate, >plicate. Flowers white, erect or slightly nodding, 10-30; perigone >funnelform-craterform. Two to three species., Maylasia, Philippines, >Australia." > >Arnold ************************************************* Jim Shields USDA Zone 5 Shields Gardens, Ltd. P.O. Box 92 WWW: http://www.shieldsgardens.com/ Westfield, Indiana 46074, USA Tel. ++1-317-867-3344 or toll-free 1-866-449-3344 in USA From arnold@nj.rr.com Sun Sep 30 20:08:46 2007 Message-Id: <47003A79.4050009@nj.rr.com> From: Arnold Trachtenberg Subject: Cardwell Lily Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 20:08:25 -0400 http://www.plant.id.au/home/guide_view.aspx?id=5 For a look at the Cardwell lily. Arnold From othonna@gmail.com Sun Sep 30 22:27:02 2007 Message-Id: <8e8da5260709301927u13e3d133ja0c81a5f532d7274@mail.gmail.com> From: Hannon Subject: Cardwell Lily Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 19:27:02 -0700 Erin, I suspect your bulbs suffered the extremely cruel fate that amaryllids often suffer when they are prepared for shipment by commercial concerns-- the bulbs were stripped of their roots. Since they are perennial roots that build up over time this butchering can set the plants back 2-3 seasons or longer, even if they flower the first season from existing flower buds stored in the bulb. They often need careful attention in the initial stages of re-establishing the root system. I have several P. amboinensis and one just finished flowering (1st time) and is now producing what look like fertile fruits, like little glossy green oranges, without hand-pollination. It is truly a tropical plant and likely would not appreciate low temps much below 55-60 in winter. It thrives in shade, quite a bit of shade even, and that is when the membranous leaf blades with their magnificent venation look best. With proper shading it should be ok in your hot summers; your warm nights should be ideal. I would call it "slow" since it does not offset readily but apparently can over time if left undistrurbed. I am not completely certain of this but it seems to be a "monsoon season" plant and thus begins growth at the start of summer and looses its leaves in late fall. So, don't try to coax it into growth in spring unless it sends out new leaves on its own. The bulbs benefit greatly by having free root run (like most amaryllids) and so you might try starting the bulb/s in fairly small pots (5" or 6" diam) and once the leaves develop, and the soil requires extra watering because of all the new roots in a small space, "plunge" them in a planter or raised bed of loose organic mix for the summer and remove them to a warmer location in fall/winter. This will probably generate some trauma to the roots each fall but should bring better results that confining them to larger containers. They seem to do better with roots on the moist side in dormancy and generous watering and fertilizing when growing. An organic, sandy mix suits them. The top of the bulbs should be just under the surface of the mix. Good luck! Dylan On 9/30/07, jegrace wrote: > Last year I acquired 3 bulbs for Proiphys (Eurycles) amboinensis (Cardwell > lilies) > > I potted them up, but they never bloomed for me. This year 2 sent up > leaves, one did not but appears to be in good shape. 2 rotted. There are > not a ton of roots on any of them. > > I have found very little information on these other than the fact that they > require a winter dormancy and shade. > > I live in hardiness zone 8b (heat zone 9) on the GA/FL border. Winters are > short but have occasional hard freezes. Summers are very, very hot. We are > officially in drought conditions but have had quite a bit of rain in the > last month, and when it rains it rains HARD. > > I would appreciate any available info on native habitat, how deep to plant, > fast/slow draining soil, rich/lean soil, PH requirements, fertilization, > etc. > > Thank you! > > Erin Grace > Thomasville, GA > USA > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki >