Shirley wrote > Leo, thanks.... We... > appreciate this type of information. Michael wrote > ...your... note on transposons is exactly the sort of information > I'm looking for. Unfortunately, most of the books I've found in > the library are either totally theoretical, focus on breeding > barley, or are so general that they aren't useful. I'd love to > find a practical, applied guide to > hybridizing ornamentals. If anyone has suggestions, I'm all ears. Plant genetics is vastly more complicated than what I wrote. My post was really a long question asking how to account for a very rare red flower in a species with white flowers. Mendelian genetics explains some flower color schemes, and he did his work in sweet peas. There are many other ways plants manage their DNA to produce flower color (or DNA manages the flower color to produce plants, depending on which end of the stick you are holding.) Unfortunately the genetics of flower color vary so much from species to species that a lot of work needs to be done in each species to figure it out. I don't really know much about it, which is why I asked my question. In the pre-DNA era breeders figured it out by making thousands of crosses, raising millions of progeny, taking detailed notes of everything, and thinking long and hard. I suspect in the DNA era it's exactly the same. Leo Martin Phoenix Arizona USA > > > -----Original Message----- > From: pbs-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org [mailto:pbs-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] > On Behalf Of Leo A. Martin > Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2014 6:23 PM > To: pbs@lists.ibiblio.org > Subject: [pbs] Transposons and Color was Virused Bulbs > > > To my understanding, many cultivated flowering plants with colored or white > flowers on different plants reveal simple Mendelian inheritance of pigment production. > That is, the wild type plant has colored flowers, reflecting one > functioning set of color genes on each of the pair of chromosomes governing flower color, > whereas white-flowered plants have two sets of defective pigment production systems. > Having two of the same gene complexes is > referred to as being homozygous and having one normal and one abnormal is referred to as > being heterozygous. So, plants having two functioning complexes would be referred to as > being wild type homozygous, plants with two abnormal complexes would be referred to as > being aberrantly homozygous, and plants with one of each would be heterozygous. > > In some cases plants having one chromosome with functioning pigment genes > and one without functioning pigment genes (heterozygous) have the normal flower color, > and in other cases they have paler flowers (think red, white and pink in sweet peas / > Lathyrus > odoratus.) > > If two wild-type homozygous plants breed, all their progeny will have normal > flower colors (barring new mutations.) If two aberrantly-homozygous plants and white > flowers breed, all their progeny will have white flowers. If one wild-type homozygous > plant breeds with one homozygous-aberrant plant, all the progeny will be heterozygous, > with one normal gene complex and one abnormal gene complex, and all will have colored > flowers, since all will produce some pigment. But if two of these heterozygous plants > breed, a quarter of their progeny will be wild-type homozygous, a quarter will be > aberrantly homozygous, and half will be heterozygous. > > How them to explain flower color in Bombax ellipticum? (Or perhaps > Pseudobombax ellipticum. I haven't read the paper.) This is a tree from > Mexico with a large under- and above-ground storage trunk. For years it was > in Bombacaceae, but a lot of reassortment has been going on, and I think it is now a kind > of cotton. Everybody I know who has been to habitat during bloom season says all the > trees have white flowers. Almost all its American relatives have white flowers. But > there is a form, planted rarely here and there throughout Mexico, always in cultivation, > with red flowers. It can be seen at the four corners of one of the town squares in > Tehuantepec, and in at least one private garden each in Oaxaca city. This > red form does not have the thick bulbous base of the wild type, and it seems to me the > red ones are all cutting-grown. The red form has similar flowers and leaves to the white > form. I know there is a red-flowered tree in Bombacaceae from tropical Asia, but the > Mexican plant does not look to me > like photos I have seen of this species. > > How to account for a plant with wild-type white flowers and one instance of > a red sport? Transposons revealing function in an otherwise-silenced red pigment > production gene complex? I don't have the red form so I can't perform crosses to see what > happens. I know a number of people in metro Phoenix with blooming wild-type Bombax > ellipticum. > > Leo Martin > Phoenix Arizona USA > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki/ > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > Message: 9 > Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2014 23:39:22 -0700 > From: "Michael Mace" <michaelcmace@gmail.com> > To: <pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> > Subject: [pbs] 2014 Moraea hybrids > Message-ID: <040c01cf5487$9ca63490$d5f29db0$@gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > Hi, gang. > > > > > If you don't like hybrids, move on to the next message. > > > > > I've written up the 2014 results from my Moraea breeding experiments. This > year I had several new flowers with stripes and spots, the closest thing yet to a red > flower, some interesting pastels, and the usual odd color combinations. You can see > photos here: > > > > http://growingcoolplants.blogspot.com/2014/04/… > l > > > > (I'll be gradually getting this info loaded into the wiki, but I put it up > on my own blog first because it's easier.) > > > > If you haven't heard the background on this project, I've been growing > Moraea species for years, and I'm passionate about preserving them in > cultivation. But after a while you get most of the species that are available, and you no > longer have new things to look forward to each year. So I started trying to create > Moraea hybrids, focusing mostly on the > "peacock" flowers and their relatives (members of the old subgenus > Vieusseuxia). They turned out to be very easy to breed. > > > > > I am very much an amateur at this stuff, and would appreciate advice from > the more experienced growers out there (especially info on how colors mix and on breeding > strategy). I'm also happy to correspond with anyone growing Moraeas, and am glad to > share seeds and offsets. > > > > Also, if you know of legitimate sources for the less commonly-offered Moraea > species, please let me know. I have a long list of species I'm still looking for. > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Mike > > > San Jose, CA > > > Zone 9, min temp 20F (-7C) > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > Message: 10 > Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2014 23:53:55 -0700 > From: Karl Church <64kkmjr@gmail.com> > To: Pacific Bulb Society <pbs@lists.ibiblio.org> > Subject: Re: [pbs] 2014 Moraea hybrids > Message-ID: > <CAGquAQiu_oxw=5hSk2tzv=tJSS=Zx27sW6pTBRVrdiN89J2HgQ@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > > Mike, > Tried to view your photos but got a message stating the page doesn't exist. > I would definitely like to see what you've achieved. As a beginner in the > growing of South African bulbs I would appreciate an advise, suggestions on how to grow > them from seed (little or no success so far) & any offsets or seeds you would care to > share. Karl Church > Dinuba CA > On Apr 9, 2014 11:39 PM, "Michael Mace" <michaelcmace@gmail.com> wrote: > > >> Hi, gang. >> >> >> >> >> If you don't like hybrids, move on to the next message. >> >> >> >> >> I've written up the 2014 results from my Moraea breeding experiments. This >> year I had several new flowers with stripes and spots, the closest thing yet to a red >> flower, some interesting pastels, and the usual odd color combinations. You can see >> photos here: >> >> >> >> >> http://growingcoolplants.blogspot.com/2014/04/… >> l >> >> >> >> (I'll be gradually getting this info loaded into the wiki, but I put it up >> on my own blog first because it's easier.) >> >> >> >> If you haven't heard the background on this project, I've been growing >> Moraea species for years, and I'm passionate about preserving them in >> cultivation. But after a while you get most of the species that are available, and you >> no longer have new things to look forward to each year. So I started trying to create >> Moraea hybrids, focusing mostly on the >> "peacock" flowers and their relatives (members of the old subgenus >> Vieusseuxia). They turned out to be very easy to breed. >> >> >> >> >> I am very much an amateur at this stuff, and would appreciate advice from >> the more experienced growers out there (especially info on how colors mix and on >> breeding strategy). I'm also happy to correspond with anyone growing Moraeas, and am >> glad to share seeds and offsets. >> >> >> >> Also, if you know of legitimate sources for the less commonly-offered >> Moraea >> species, please let me know. I have a long list of species I'm still looking for. >> >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> >> >> Mike >> >> >> San Jose, CA >> >> >> Zone 9, min temp 20F (-7C) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php >> http://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki/ >> >> > > > ------------------------------ > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list pbs@lists.ibiblio.org http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > > > > End of pbs Digest, Vol 135, Issue 13 > ************************************ > >