SARAH-LISTS sarah-lists@suiattle.net
Sat, 01 Feb 2020 18:03:14 PST
Oh and Mike, I am a scientist, and an ecologist at that!

Thanks for being brave

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 31, 2020, at 16:04, Mike Rummerfield <mikerumm@gmail.com> wrote:
> Jo&Greg,
> Thank you for your response and support.  It means so much to me.
> I was very nervous and anxious about sending any response at all to that
> emailer (I'm trying not to use names in order not to be accusatory toward
> any individual.  Perhaps this is a mistake).   I thought I could possibly
> even be banished from the PBS email list, but I just can't be quiet any
> longer.
> I'm not a scientist.  I'm a gardener, both by vocation (now retired) and
> avocation with a keen interest in a healthy planet.
> I just wish more people would stop to think about the results of their
> decisions, and I wish I had the intellectual capacity to address this issue
> succinctly, articulately, convincingly, and irrefutably (fat chance of
> that!).  It all seems so overwhelming.
> Interestingly, the two emails I've received in support of my response have
> both come from Canadians.
> Yay Canada!
> Thank you again,
> Mike
>> On Fri, Jan 31, 2020 at 3:22 PM Jo&Greg <sun-coast-pearl@telus.net> wrote:
>> Mike--
>> Many thanks for your viewpoint. You said it better than I could.
>> Jo Canning
>> Vancouver Island
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: pbs <pbs-bounces@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> On Behalf Of Mike
>> Rummerfield
>> Sent: Friday, January 31, 2020 2:20 PM
>> To: Pacific Bulb Society <pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net>
>> Subject: Re: [pbs] Herbicides
>> If, as you say, " it's important to look at the details wherein is
>> contained the devil and you clearly cannot obtain accurate facts from
>> "like-minded individuals" on social media", then it seems that all the
>> research you've done and presented is from "like-minded individuals", and
>> industry sponsored and published papers.  It only takes a cursory search to
>> find the refutation of your arguments for the 'safety' of herbicides, and
>> glyphosate in particular.  You could start with non Hodgkins lymphoma/Mayo
>> clinic; plus the multitude of lawsuits involving individuals with non
>> Hodgkins lymphoma and Bayer, the current owner of Roundup;  Agent
>> Orange/Vietnam veterans;  lawsuits won in court resulting in Monsanto
>> having to withdraw their claim that glysophate binds with soil particles,
>> making it benign; The World Health Organization/glyphosate;
>> California/glyphosate; glyphosate resistant Superweeds (although I suppose
>> you could argue for Superhippeastrums) ; the list goes on and on
>> and.....................
>> The "organic chemicals" you refer to are organic in the sense that they
>> contain carbon and hydrogen in their makeup  (most organic compounds
>> contain at least one carbon–hydrogen bond, hence the name hydrocarbon).
>> This misleading argument has for many years fed into the confusion over,
>> and the difference between, organic chemistry and organic standards
>> regarding food production and the environment.   Though they share the word
>> 'organic', they are completely different subjects, though obviously
>> intertwined.
>> You say, "Glyphosate, for one is the 800 pound gorilla because it is so
>> safe and useful".  What is this statement based on?  Is glyphosate useful?
>> Yes (if you are willing to ignore the downsides).  Is it effective at
>> killing some weeds?  Yes.  Is it convenient and easy to use?  Yes, very.
>> Is it safe? * No *(see above).  "There are approximately 280 million
>> pounds of glyphosate applied to 298 million acres annually in agricultural
>> settings (MRD, 2012-2016).Apr 18, 2019"  This is *per year*.
>> Follow the money.
>> All the rationalizations for the continued use of herbicides do not make
>> it safe.
>> Denial and diversion have not proven to be effective strategies in matters
>> of life.
>> Don, I think the relevant issue here is not whether Hippeastrum is
>> resistant to glyphosate (Roundup) or not.  It is whether glyphosate is safe
>> to use or not - not just safe for the Hippeastrum, but safe for other
>> living things, including us.
>> All areas of the world have their own set of weeds that are difficult to
>> control.  Yours are bermuda grass and nut sedge.   In my area, two of them
>> are quack grass and canary grass, and I detest them; there are others.
>> Just try arguing with our ubiquitous Himalayan blackberry - you quickly
>> become a torn, shredded, bloody mess.  There are other strategies to
>> dealing with these pests other than the application of glyphosate, though
>> they may be less convenient and easy.
>> I guess this all comes down to priorities - the short term convenience and
>> ease of use vs. the longer term promotion of life.
>> Most sincerely,
>> Mike
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