Herbicides

Tim Harvey zigur@hotmail.com
Fri, 31 Jan 2020 17:31:40 PST
I’ve never seen such rubbish on PBS. 

 T

> On Jan 31, 2020, at 2:20 PM, Mike Rummerfield <mikerumm@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> If, as you say, " it's important to look at the details wherein is
> contained the devil and you clearly cannot obtain accurate facts from
> "like-minded individuals" on social media", then it seems that all the
> research you've done and presented is from "like-minded individuals", and
> industry sponsored and published papers.  It only takes a cursory search to
> find the refutation of your arguments for the 'safety' of herbicides, and
> glyphosate in particular.  You could start with non Hodgkins lymphoma/Mayo
> clinic; plus the multitude of lawsuits involving individuals with non
> Hodgkins lymphoma and Bayer, the current owner of Roundup;  Agent
> Orange/Vietnam veterans;  lawsuits won in court resulting in Monsanto
> having to withdraw their claim that glysophate binds with soil particles,
> making it benign; The World Health Organization/glyphosate;
> California/glyphosate; glyphosate resistant Superweeds (although I suppose
> you could argue for Superhippeastrums) ; the list goes on and on
> and.....................
> 
> The "organic chemicals" you refer to are organic in the sense that they
> contain carbon and hydrogen in their makeup  (most organic compounds
> contain at least one carbon–hydrogen bond, hence the name hydrocarbon).
> This misleading argument has for many years fed into the confusion over,
> and the difference between, organic chemistry and organic standards
> regarding food production and the environment.   Though they share the word
> 'organic', they are completely different subjects, though obviously
> intertwined.
> 
> You say, "Glyphosate, for one is the 800 pound gorilla because it is so
> safe and useful".  What is this statement based on?  Is glyphosate useful?
> Yes (if you are willing to ignore the downsides).  Is it effective at
> killing some weeds?  Yes.  Is it convenient and easy to use?  Yes, very.
> Is it safe? * No *(see above).  "There are approximately 280 million pounds
> of glyphosate applied to 298 million acres annually in agricultural
> settings (MRD, 2012-2016).Apr 18, 2019"  This is *per year*.
> Follow the money.
> 
> All the rationalizations for the continued use of herbicides do not make it
> safe.
> 
> Denial and diversion have not proven to be effective strategies in matters
> of life.
> 
> Don, I think the relevant issue here is not whether Hippeastrum is
> resistant to glyphosate (Roundup) or not.  It is whether glyphosate is safe
> to use or not - not just safe for the Hippeastrum, but safe for other
> living things, including us.
> All areas of the world have their own set of weeds that are difficult to
> control.  Yours are bermuda grass and nut sedge.   In my area, two of them
> are quack grass and canary grass, and I detest them; there are others.
> Just try arguing with our ubiquitous Himalayan blackberry - you quickly
> become a torn, shredded, bloody mess.  There are other strategies to
> dealing with these pests other than the application of glyphosate, though
> they may be less convenient and easy.
> 
> I guess this all comes down to priorities - the short term convenience and
> ease of use vs. the longer term promotion of life.
> 
> Most sincerely,
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Fri, Jan 31, 2020 at 6:28 AM Tim Eck <timeck17582@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Erick,
>> Thanks for the very useful information.
>> I realize there are many prejudices against the many organic chemicals that
>> organic growers avoid and with some merit, but often misplaced blame.
>> Glyphosate, for one is the 800 pound gorilla because it is so safe and
>> useful, just like we blame Walmart for everything because it is so
>> successful.  It may be associated with colony collapse disorder (but not a
>> cause)for the simple reason that Monsanto likes to implant at least three
>> functional genes when they create a transgenic seed and one of them is
>> usually Bt, a "natural" insecticide from Bacillus thuringiensis.  The
>> assumption was that corn was wind pollinated and would not harm
>> pollinators, but it has been demonstrated that bees will use grass pollen
>> for a protein source as needed.  In this case, glyphosate use is associated
>> with the harmful factor but not the cause.
>> Glyphosate itself appears to be less toxic than table salt (according to
>> the LD50) and is captured by polar components in soil and slowly degraded
>> by soil bacteria so it has no noticeable activity in most soils.  Potting
>> soils may behave differently.  You can buy detergent-free glyphosates
>> certified for use in waterways that will not harm amphibians or
>> invertebrates.  No SCIENTIFIC studies have shown any linkage of glyphosate
>> to cancer.
>> RoundUp is a trade name that may contain other active ingredients besides
>> glyphosate, especially when modified such as RoundUp Plus which contains a
>> pre-emergent herbicide too.
>> My earliest memories were of growing up on an organic farm in the early
>> 50's so I don't defend chemical agriculture without reservations but it's
>> important to look at the details wherein is contained the devil and you
>> clearly cannot obtain accurate facts from "like-minded individuals" on
>> social media.
>> End of rant,
>> Tim
>> 
>> 
>>> On Thu, Jan 30, 2020 at 10:15 PM erick lux <ericklux@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I've used the brands Snapshot, Amaze and Surflan at different times at
>> the
>>> recommended rate with no problem on a huge variety of amaryllis.
>>> 
>>>> On Fri, Jan 24, 2020 at 1:37 PM Tim Eck <timeck17582@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Can anybody suggest a good pre-emergent herbicide that is safe to use
>> on
>>>> amaryllids?  I've never used a pre-emergent but some people swear by
>>> them.
>>>> 
>>>> Also, are dicot (broadleaf) herbicides like dicamba safe for
>> amaryllids?
>>>> I've never gotten anybody to admit it even though they tell me they're
>>>> ineffective on amaryllids.
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Tim
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> pbs mailing list
>>>> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net
>>>> http://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/…
>>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> pbs mailing list
>>> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net
>>> http://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/…
>>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> pbs mailing list
>> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net
>> http://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/…
>> 
> _______________________________________________
> pbs mailing list
> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net
> http://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/…
_______________________________________________
pbs mailing list
pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net
http://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/…


More information about the pbs mailing list