Okay, Bridget. You will be hearing from me. Mike R. Onalaska, WA On Sun, Mar 30, 2025 at 7:47 AM fritchick via pbs < pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> wrote: > Good morning, evening.... > I've read the thread, see where it began, respect folk's opinions and > consider it my job to ask everyone to rest your fingers. > > Emotions are aflame for some on the subject. Everyone has an opinion and > wants to be heard. > > Not here. Find another forum. There are thousands. > The List isn't your megaphone as it's a captive audience and that is > unfair. > > I won't brook any further giggles, slams, outpourings or finger-pointing on > my watch. > If you have an issue with that, kindly email me personally. > This ends here. > > Bridget > President, BX Manager. > > > > > On Sun, Mar 30, 2025 at 10:29 AM B Spencer via pbs < > pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> wrote: > > > Oh, please, can we take a deep breath. Gardening brings us together. It > is > > not meant to divide us. Sad. > > Enough said! > > Bea > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > > On Mar 30, 2025, at 9:14 AM, Leigh Blake via pbs < > > pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> wrote: > > > > > > I agree this is the EXACT place for "polly-ticks"!!!! I've never > > posted > > > on this site before I do hope it goes through...we are losing all that > > > we've ever trusted in our nation and those who do not see this site > as a > > > place for a forum againd the regime that has moved to take over this > > > country MIGHT WAKE UP those who want to ignore it!!! All of us who > > garden > > > cherish our love of plants....and EVERYTHING will be affected!! > Thanks, > > > Mark!!! To Ann R I hope you are aware of the nazi take over...I HOPE > > you > > > understand that we must fight this...we are too close to Germany > > > 1938...before the take over of Poland and the eventual HOLOCAUST...I am > > NOT > > > overstating this danger!!! > > > > > >> On Sun, Mar 30, 2025 at 12:24 AM Ray Vanveen via pbs < > > >> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> wrote: > > >> > > >> This not the site to publish political opinions > > >> Person should be banned ftom Society > > >> In my opinion > > >> Sent from my iPhone > > >> > > >>> On Mar 30, 2025, at 5:15 AM, Mark Akimoff via pbs < > > >> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> wrote: > > >>> > > >>> I think the cuts at the government level that are affecting > > agriculture > > >> and all the business surrounding the nursery trade and bulb growing > > >> eventually will “trickle down” into every aspect of gardening and our > > >> lives, so it’s important to stay informed of what is going on at that > > >> level. In that regard, this is absolutely the place for discussion of > > how > > >> politics affects us as growers and gardeners. The usda impacts many > > aspects > > >> of bulb growing, from the inspection of nursery crops to the APHIS-PPQ > > >> regulations, to research at the germplasm level and many pest and > > disease > > >> control measures. If this disappears so too may interstate commerce of > > >> flower bulbs, which could greatly impact all of us Pacific Bulb > Society > > >> members. > > >>> > > >>> I say please keep discussing so we are all informed of the changes > that > > >> may affect us all at some point. > > >>> > > >>> Mark > > >>> > > >>>> On Mar 29, 2025, at 4:25 PM, Ann R via pbs < > > >> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> wrote: > > >>>> > > >>>> Really, this is not the place for politics. > > >>>> > > >>>>> On Thu, Mar 20, 2025, 5:00 AM < > > >> pbs-request@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > >>>>> wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Send pbs mailing list submissions to > > >>>>> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > > >>>>> > > >>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > >>>>> > > >> https://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… > > >>>>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > > >>>>> pbs-request@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > > >>>>> > > >>>>> You can reach the person managing the list at > > >>>>> pbs-owner@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > > >>>>> > > >>>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > > >>>>> than "Re: Contents of pbs digest..." > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> List-Post:<mailto:pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > > >>>>> List-Archive:<http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/list.php > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Today's Topics: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> 1. "DOGE?s Cuts at the USDA Could Cause US Grocery Prices to > > >>>>> Rise and Invasive Species to Spread" (Lee Poulsen) > > >>>>> 2. Re: "DOGE?s Cuts at the USDA Could Cause US Grocery Prices > > >>>>> to Rise and Invasive Species to Spread" (Robert Lauf) > > >>>>> 3. Re: "DOGE?s Cuts at the USDA Could Cause US Grocery Prices > > >>>>> to Rise and Invasive Species to Spread" (Michael Homick) > > >>>>> 4. Re: "DOGE?s Cuts at the USDA Could Cause US Grocery Prices > > >>>>> to Rise and Invasive Species to Spread" (Robert Lauf) > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Message: 1 > > >>>>> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2025 11:02:52 -0700 > > >>>>> From: Lee Poulsen <wpoulsen@pacbell.net> > > >>>>> To: Pacific Bulb Society <pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > >>>>> Subject: [pbs] "DOGE?s Cuts at the USDA Could Cause US Grocery > Prices > > >>>>> to Rise and Invasive Species to Spread" > > >>>>> Message-ID: <2A51259E-CEA1-4908-B795-FCE001C0819C@pacbell.net> > > >>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Saw this news article yesterday: "DOGE?s Cuts at the USDA Could > Cause > > >> US > > >>>>> Grocery Prices to Rise and Invasive Species to Spread? > > >>>>> < > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://wired.com/story/usda-food-supply-chains/… > > >>>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Here are some excerpts: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> 6,000 employees were let go at the USDA (US Dept. of Agriculture) > in > > >>>>> February as part of a government-wide purge orchestrated by the > Trump > > >>>>> administration and Elon Musk?s so-called Department of Government > > >>>>> Efficiency (DOGE). > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Before he received his termination notice, he says, Copeland had > just > > >>>>> spent several months training the only dog stationed in Florida > > >> capable of > > >>>>> detecting the Giant African land snail, an invasive mollusk that > > poses > > >> a > > >>>>> significant threat to Florida agriculture. ?We have dogs for > spotted > > >> and > > >>>>> lantern flies, Asian longhorn beetles,? he says, referring to two > > other > > >>>>> non-native species. ?I don?t think the American people realize how > > much > > >>>>> crap that people bring into the United States.? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Dog trainers are just one example of the kind of highly specialized > > >> USDA > > >>>>> staff that have been removed from their stations in recent weeks. > > Teams > > >>>>> devoted to inspecting plant and food imports have been hit > especially > > >> hard > > >>>>> by the recent cuts, including the Plant Protection and Quarantine > > >> program, > > >>>>> which has lost hundreds of staffers alone. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> ?It?s causing problems left and right,? says one current USDA > worker, > > >> who > > >>>>> like other federal employees in this story asked to remain > anonymous > > >> for > > >>>>> fear of retaliation. ?It?s basically a skeleton crew working now,? > > says > > >>>>> another current USDA staffer, who noted that both they and most of > > >> their > > >>>>> colleagues held advanced degrees and had many years of training to > > >> protect > > >>>>> US food and agriculture supply chains from invasive pests. ?It?s > not > > >>>>> something that is easily replaced by artificial intelligence.? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> The USDA cuts are being felt especially in coastal states home to > > major > > >>>>> shipping ports. USDA sources who spoke to WIRED estimate that the > > Port > > >> of > > >>>>> Los Angeles, one of the busiest in the US, lost around 35 percent > of > > >> its > > >>>>> total Plant Protection and Quarantine staff and 60 percent of its > > >>>>> ?smuggling and interdiction? employees, who are tasked with > stopping > > >>>>> illegal pests and goods from entering the country. The Port of > Miami, > > >> which > > >>>>> handles high volumes of US plant imports, lost about 35 percent of > > its > > >>>>> plant inspectors. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> ----- > > >>>>> So for those of us in the U.S., I have questions: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> 1. Does this mean that plant material that we import will just sit > at > > >> the > > >>>>> inspection station (where the green and yellow label directs it) > and > > >> remain > > >>>>> there (and possibly die) until one of the diminished staff finally > > gets > > >>>>> around to inspecting it? Or will they just start sending a bunch of > > >> stuff > > >>>>> on uninspected so that the pile of uninspected items doesn?t just > > keep > > >>>>> growing to overwhelming proportions? (And for those so inclined, > > might > > >> this > > >>>>> be an opportunity to try to import plants, bulbs, or seeds for > which > > >> it is > > >>>>> difficult to impossible to obtain a phytosanitary certificate from > > the > > >>>>> sender?s country or which are not allowed? ??) > > >>>>> > > >>>>> 2. Does anyone know how this will affect the South African bulb > > order? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> 3. Should those of us in the US stop trying to import any plants, > > >> bulbs, > > >>>>> or seeds from abroad for the foreseeable future, or until things > get > > >> back > > >>>>> to ?normal? (whenever that will be)? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> 4. And what about things we?ve already ordered and paid for that > are > > on > > >>>>> the way, but might not arrive until after April 2? Even if they do > > >> make it > > >>>>> through inspection without too much delay, the current plan is to > > start > > >>>>> charging tariffs on everything imported from every country starting > > on > > >>>>> April 2. Will customs hold onto everything that arrives and notify > > the > > >>>>> recipient that they need to pay the new tariff before it will be > > >> released? > > >>>>> How will that be done? Will they send it on out once the tariff is > > >> paid, or > > >>>>> do we have to figure out how to ship it from customs to us and pay > > for > > >> any > > >>>>> additional shipping charges? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> 5. I wonder if any new plant pests or diseases really will get in > > >> during > > >>>>> this time? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> --Lee Poulsen > > >>>>> San Gabriel Valley, California, USA - USDA Zone 10a > > >>>>> Latitude 34?N, Altitude 340 ft/100 m > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> ------------------------------ > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Message: 2 > > >>>>> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2025 18:47:42 +0000 (UTC) > > >>>>> From: Robert Lauf <boblauf@att.net> > > >>>>> To: Lee Poulsen via pbs <pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > >>>>> Subject: Re: [pbs] "DOGE?s Cuts at the USDA Could Cause US Grocery > > >>>>> Prices to Rise and Invasive Species to Spread" > > >>>>> Message-ID: <1765924249.6020367.1742410062270@mail.yahoo.com> > > >>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Leigh and Johann have been diligently working on processing our > group > > >>>>> order since Tues of last week.? They hope everything will be dug, > > >> washed, > > >>>>> and suitably dry by the end of the month and will be shipped around > > >> April 1. > > >>>>> I have spoken with the supervisory inspectors in both Jamaica, NY > > (JFK) > > >>>>> and Linden, NJ (Newark) and they assured me that they have no > problem > > >> doing > > >>>>> what we did last time in ATL, viz., inspecting and shipping > directly > > to > > >>>>> Bridget, rather than to me, using the UPS labels we will have > > enclosed > > >> in > > >>>>> the orders. > > >>>>> I specifically asked the lady in Linden what the work load is like > at > > >> her > > >>>>> station vs JFK and she said she wasn't sure about JFK but generally > > at > > >> her > > >>>>> station plants are in and out typically in two days.? That was our > > >>>>> experience at ATL as well.? The article cites a 35% reduction in > > >> inspection > > >>>>> staff, and laughably describes what's left as a "skeleton crew".? > But > > >> doing > > >>>>> the math, adding 35% to the 2-day turnaround time doesn't strike me > > as > > >> a > > >>>>> crisis in the offing. > > >>>>> Lastly, it is important to note that to the dormant bulb, a week or > > >> two in > > >>>>> a clean cardboard box, mostly at room temperature, is a walk in the > > >> park > > >>>>> compared to baking in the ground during the dry season in the > > Kalahari. > > >>>>> Bottom line is that I don't think the sky is falling and Uncle Sam > > can > > >> get > > >>>>> all the liposuction treatments possible and life will go on.? Our > > order > > >>>>> this time totals well over $6000 and 41 member orders.? We expect > > >> things to > > >>>>> go smoothly.? Please keep Bridget in your thoughts and prayers as > she > > >>>>> braces for the arrival and distribution phase of the project. > > >>>>> As to the issue of tariffs, this remains up in the air at the > > moment.? > > >>>>> Live plants are not subject to duties, yet the customs broker > working > > >> for > > >>>>> DHL wrongly charged duties last time.? I had to jump in and pay > them > > to > > >>>>> avoid having everything sent back, and managed to claw the money > back > > >> a few > > >>>>> months later.? Worst case would be that our order arrives at > customs > > >> and we > > >>>>> have to pay something (a maximum of 20%, which appears to be what > > South > > >>>>> Africa charges on American imports).? Even with a 20% add-on the > > total > > >> will > > >>>>> still be far less than our early estimate in which we told everyone > > to > > >> plan > > >>>>> on a grand total of twice the catalog price of the bulbs.? Last > time > > it > > >>>>> worked out to more like 125% of the catalog price.? So we'll see > but > > >> most > > >>>>> members will, I think, come away satisfied with the value > > proposition. > > >>>>> In any case, I will be monitoring the shipment on a daily basis so > we > > >> can > > >>>>> respond to whatever comes up without causing delays. > > >>>>> Bob? ?infested by maple pollen in Zone 7 > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> ------------------------------ > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Message: 3 > > >>>>> Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2025 14:01:21 -0700 > > >>>>> From: Michael Homick <michaelhomick@gmail.com> > > >>>>> To: Pacific Bulb Society <pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > >>>>> Subject: Re: [pbs] "DOGE?s Cuts at the USDA Could Cause US Grocery > > >>>>> Prices to Rise and Invasive Species to Spread" > > >>>>> Message-ID: > > >>>>> < > > >>>>> CAH7Rr8d4g7o9t8WrcCoqLKszWtz+K8H2gvjrHWf4_7rrZtNE5w@mail.gmail.com > > > > >>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Hi Lee and the group: > > >>>>> I am involved with a project to disseminate and protect rare lilium > > >> species > > >>>>> in tissue culture. Last fall I placed a rather substantial order > for > > >> Lilium > > >>>>> species in tissue culture to: https://www.lilium-tc.com/. > > Previously > > >>>>> orders came through fine with just minor delays. Matthias obtained > > >> phytos > > >>>>> for everything and we had all the proper paperwork for > importation. > > >> The > > >>>>> USDA in their wisdom now gamma irradiates all plant material from > > >> Austria > > >>>>> due to potato cyst nematodes. So when my shipment and others who > also > > >>>>> ordered separately got their plants everything was cooked. > > >>>>> I evn planned on making a trip physically to Austria this year ( > > round > > >> trip > > >>>>> approx $700.00) but restrictions permit only 12 plants to be > > physically > > >>>>> brought back on your person. I called the USDA to verify this > > >> restriction > > >>>>> and was told that indeed twelve plants is the limit and that they > > would > > >>>>> also be subjected to irradiation. The logic is that plants grown > from > > >> seed > > >>>>> in tissue culture would have no contact with potato cyst nematodes > or > > >> soil. > > >>>>> It is all very frustrating. Um.... maybe a lead lined shipping > > >> container? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> ------------------------------ > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Message: 4 > > >>>>> Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2025 02:27:02 +0000 (UTC) > > >>>>> From: Robert Lauf <boblauf@att.net> > > >>>>> To: Michael Homick via pbs <pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > >>>>> Subject: Re: [pbs] "DOGE?s Cuts at the USDA Could Cause US Grocery > > >>>>> Prices to Rise and Invasive Species to Spread" > > >>>>> Message-ID: <1010753399.6207794.1742437622276@mail.yahoo.com> > > >>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Michael, > > >>>>> You have discovered another complication in the business.? There > are > > a > > >> lot > > >>>>> of one-off restrictions that might or might not be visible to you > > when > > >> you > > >>>>> set up your import permit.? For instance, when I was setting my > > permit > > >> to > > >>>>> include all the genera that members wanted, four of them? > (Crocosmia, > > >>>>> Gladiolus, Gloriosa, and Watsonia) cannot be added to the permit if > > >> coming > > >>>>> from South Africa.? A flag says these are NOT ALLOWED entry at > all, I > > >>>>> believe because they can harbor brown potato rot.? So we had to > > remove > > >> them > > >>>>> from any order that has them on it. > > >>>>> Issues like that are definitely not negotiable.? However, I do note > > >> that > > >>>>> there are various permits, including one to allow importing of live > > >> pests > > >>>>> for use in research (I'm not making this up).? You might want to > > delve > > >> into > > >>>>> the more exotic permit classes to see if there is one that is > > tailored > > >>>>> specifically for bottle babies; as I recall, one can get docs that > > >> allow > > >>>>> importing bottles of orchid seedlings of species that are on CITES > > and > > >>>>> would otherwise be illegal to sell if wild-collected. > > >>>>> If you haven't already done so, you might call the guy at the APHIS > > >> mother > > >>>>> ship in Maryland.? You'll get a robo-operator but at the > appropriate > > >> point > > >>>>> in the menu, pick the one about importing live plants and then > leave > > a > > >>>>> message.? He will get back to you promptly, and has always been > very > > >>>>> helpful when I have questions.? He might know of a work-around for > > your > > >>>>> problem.? But when it comes to serious threats to food crops, they > > >> will err > > >>>>> on the side of caution, and we can't blame them. > > >>>>> Contact me privately if you want to discuss things in more detail.? > > >> But it > > >>>>> sounds like Austria might be the deal breaker and your supplier > needs > > >> to > > >>>>> set up a lab someplace else.? Good luck! > > >>>>> Bob? ?Zone 7, waiting for the rain tonight. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> ------------------------------ > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Subject: Digest Footer > > >>>>> > > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>>> pbs mailing list > > >>>>> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > > >>>>> https://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… > > >>>>> Unsubscribe: <mailto:pbs-unsubscribe@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > >>>>> PBS Forum latest: > > >>>>> > https://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbsforum/index.php/… > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> ------------------------------ > > >>>>> > > >>>>> End of pbs Digest, Vol 97, Issue 13 > > >>>>> *********************************** > > >>>>> > > >>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>> pbs mailing list > > >>>> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > > >>>> https://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… > > >>>> Unsubscribe: <mailto:pbs-unsubscribe@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > >>>> PBS Forum latest: > > >> https://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbsforum/index.php/… > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > >>> pbs mailing list > > >>> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > > >>> https://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… > > >>> Unsubscribe: <mailto:pbs-unsubscribe@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > >>> PBS Forum latest: > > >> https://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbsforum/index.php/… > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> pbs mailing list > > >> pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > > >> https://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… > > >> Unsubscribe: <mailto:pbs-unsubscribe@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > >> PBS Forum latest: > > >> https://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbsforum/index.php/… > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ > > > pbs mailing list > > > pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > > > https://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… > > > Unsubscribe: <mailto:pbs-unsubscribe@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > > PBS Forum latest: > > https://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbsforum/index.php/… > > _______________________________________________ > > pbs mailing list > > pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > > https://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… > > Unsubscribe: <mailto:pbs-unsubscribe@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > > PBS Forum latest: > > https://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbsforum/index.php/… > > > _______________________________________________ > pbs mailing list > pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net > https://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… > Unsubscribe: <mailto:pbs-unsubscribe@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> > PBS Forum latest: > https://pacificbulbsociety.org/pbsforum/index.php/… > _______________________________________________ pbs mailing list pbs@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net https://lists.pacificbulbsociety.net/cgi-bin/… Unsubscribe: <mailto:pbs-unsubscribe@lists.pacificbulbsociety.net> PBS Forum https://…